Ware Glossary - Annual Review

[Susan Bugher]

Ware Glossary - Annual Review

This is the annual review of alt.comp.freeware's Ware Glossary. The
glossary contains ACF's definitions of Freeware related terminology.
It's our dictionary - it helps us speak a common language when we post
in the alt.comp.freeware newsgroup.

The purpose of the review is to affirm and/or revise the information in
the glossary. New ware descriptions can be added, existing descriptions
can be improved.

We use the ware glossary as a reference when we define the rules for
acceptable and unacceptable ware types for the Pricelessware List..
Pricelessware rules are not part of this discussion. "da rules" should
be discussed in the "PL2007 Schedule and Procedures" thread.

The full text of the glossary is copied below. Revisions will be made
based on the consensus in the newsgroup. If a consensus cannot be
achieved through discussion the group will be polled.

Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be useful
(quote *only* the text you wish to revise if you are proposing a
revised definition).

Susan

------------------

http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php


Software: the instructions executed by a computer.

In theory software does not include the data processed by the
instructions. In practice a combination of instructions and data is
often called software.

Below is a brief glossary defining ware types shown on the
Pricelessware pages and/ or used in the alt.comp.freeware newsgroup.

Several ware types may be used when describing a program (for
example: Donationware and Liteware and Betaware). Ware types are listed
in alphabetical order.

Abandonware: software that the original owner no longer offers
to the public. Abandonware refers to a product that is no longer
marketed or distributed by the author/company that published it.
Orphanware is used when the author cannot be located or the company is
no longer in existence. Copyright laws apply to Orphanware and
Abandonware. The programs are freeware only if they were released as
freeware (or given freeware status by the owner at a later date).

Adware: software that displays advertising for other products
and/or services (often downloaded from the internet by the software)..

Betaware: a preliminary but useable version of what will be the
final version of a program. Beta versions are intended for testing by
users (alpha versions are test versions for the developers).

CDware: promo CDs included with magazines, books or other products

Commercial Software: software that is sold.

Crippleware: free version of a commercial program. More limited
in features and functionality than the commercial product. Crippleware
has severe limitations. Functionality that is important to the average
user has been disabled.

Demoware: software that is intended to give potential
purchasers an idea of how the program works. Not a full version, type of
limitation varies.

Donationware: monetary contribution requested (optional)

Freeware: Legally obtainable software that you may use at no
cost, monetary or otherwise, for as long as you wish.

Liteware: free version of a commercial program. A useful
program that is more limited in features and functionality than the
commercial product. Liteware is not time-limited.

Malware: software that contains malicious programming

Nagware: has a popup (nag) screen, asking you to purchase the
software. You must press a button to get past the nag screen.

Orphanware: see Abandonware

Registerware: you must provide personal information via
registration in order to download and/or use the program

Requestware: you are asked to do something. Examples: send a
postcard or email to the software author, perform a good deed, make a
contribution to charity

Shareware: commercial software that can be downloaded. Payment
is required for legal use of the software. Some authors use the honor
system, more commonly code is included to prevent the use of some or all
functions if payment is not made in accordance with the shareware agreement.

Spyware: software that sends information about you and your
computer to others (usually without your knowledge and consent). Spyware
may also install files on your hard drive without your knowledge.

Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time
or number of uses.

Warez: Software that is stolen, and/or enabled, by illegal means.

============

[Dan Goodman]

Post by Susan Bugher
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be useful
(quote only the text you wish to revise if you are proposing a
revised definition).

I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use" and
"free for noncommercial use."

[Bear Bottoms]

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be useful
(quote only the text you wish to revise if you are proposing a
revised definition).

I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use" and
"free for noncommercial use."

Makes sense for those that may use some of these "freewares" commercially
:)

[Aaron]

Post by Bear Bottoms

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be useful
(quote only the text you wish to revise if you are proposing a
revised definition).

I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use"
and "free for noncommercial use."

Makes sense for those that may use some of these "freewares"
commercially
:)

I would say it's probably interesting to note, but not really a big issue
around which we use to bar software from entry into Pricelessware?

After all let's not lose sight of why we are doing this ware glossary
exercise. We want to get as accurate and precise descriptions of
charateristics of software, and use this to decide what is unacceptable
for entry into PL.

[Anne Carle]

On 10 Sep 2006 15:50:57 +0200, Aaron

Post by Aaron
After all let's not lose sight of why we are doing this ware glossary
exercise. We want to get as accurate and precise descriptions of
charateristics of software, and use this to decide what is unacceptable
for entry into PL.

How exactly would one classify Comodo's Launchpad in conjunction with
their products? It's not really nagware, but it's a nonessential,
irritating module of their otherwise good software. If they put the
Launchpad options in "about" of their products, would it then be pure
freeware?

Anne

[Bear Bottoms]

Post by Anne Carle
On 10 Sep 2006 15:50:57 +0200, Aaron

Post by Aaron
After all let's not lose sight of why we are doing this ware glossary
exercise. We want to get as accurate and precise descriptions of
charateristics of software, and use this to decide what is unacceptable
for entry into PL.

How exactly would one classify Comodo's Launchpad in conjunction with
their products? It's not really nagware, but it's a nonessential,
irritating module of their otherwise good software. If they put the
Launchpad options in "about" of their products, would it then be pure
freeware?
Anne

It is not "program purity" and is not needed for the program to function.
It loses serious points for this IMO.

Programs which are pure should maintain the title of freeware. All others
should be called by a design specific name which is what this discussion
is about.

A developers extraneous unnecessary tool for their own purpose is what it
is in Comodo's case. Call it developerware.

[Vegard Krog Petersen]

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be useful
(quote only the text you wish to revise if you are proposing a
revised definition).

I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use" and
"free for noncommercial use."

"freeware private"
"freeware commercial"

LOL
--
Vegard Krog Petersen - Norway

http://vegard2.no -
Solitaire MahJongg guide, Sarah Michelle Gellar Solitaire,
Freeware Logo & symbol, Halma & Chinese Checkers,
Pachisi & Ludo, Freeware Solitaire, My fishy site (fishing
games), a.c.f.g information, Fredrikshald Havfiskeklubb
18+ sites: Firefoxy, Adult Solitaire, Fishy Pictures,
Sexy Chess, Sexy Librarians, Sexy Football
---------------------------------------------------------

[Whirled Peas]

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be useful
(quote only the text you wish to revise if you are proposing a
revised definition).

I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use" and
"free for noncommercial use."

For example, the software available at http://www.altools.net/

From Altools website:
ALZip is free for non-commercial home use. Commercial use requires a
license. But we coordially invite commercial users to try ALZip for as
long as you want for free - there are no functionality limitations or time
limits.

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be useful
(quote only the text you wish to revise if you are proposing a
revised definition).

I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use" and
"free for noncommercial use."

Are you suggesting a change in the definition of Freeware? We don't say
anything that answers the question "free for who?" - perhaps we should.

http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php#Freeware
"Freeware: Legally obtainable software that you may use at no cost,
monetary or otherwise, for as long as you wish."

Susan

[Aaron]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be useful
(quote only the text you wish to revise if you are proposing a
revised definition).

I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use" and
"free for noncommercial use."

Are you suggesting a change in the definition of Freeware? We don't say
anything that answers the question "free for who?" - perhaps we should.

Does that mean we will see a day where freeware that is free only for
personal use is excluded for PL?

If not, what's the point? It's useful information i agree, but the ware
glossary I would think was created for a distinct purpose- to support PL
elections, it's not meant to be a full taxonomy for classification of
software.

For example, we don't talk about things like open source, freedom to
modify , freedom to distribute etc, even though those are legimate
characteristics of software.

[Bear Bottoms]

On Sun, 10 Sep 2006 10:25:22 -0500, Aaron

Post by Aaron

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be useful
(quote only the text you wish to revise if you are proposing a
revised definition).

I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use" and
"free for noncommercial use."

Are you suggesting a change in the definition of Freeware? We don't say
anything that answers the question "free for who?" - perhaps we should.

Does that mean we will see a day where freeware that is free only for
personal use is excluded for PL?
If not, what's the point? It's useful information i agree, but the ware
glossary I would think was created for a distinct purpose- to support PL
elections, it's not meant to be a full taxonomy for classification of
software.
For example, we don't talk about things like open source, freedom to
modify , freedom to distribute etc, even though those are legimate
characteristics of software.

I agree. I mean what constitutes commercial use? I use print screen at
work because I like it better for demonstration purposes in email to my
minions, but I am not using it for any public advertising or does it
enhance my product in any way. One could get lost trying to categorize
just this issue. If a company is going to utilize freeware, it would be
best for them to check on their own if there are any limitations.

[»Q«]

Post by Aaron

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be
useful (quote only the text you wish to revise if you are
proposing a revised definition).

I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any
use" and "free for noncommercial use."

Are you suggesting a change in the definition of Freeware? We
don't say anything that answers the question "free for who?" -
perhaps we should.

Does that mean we will see a day where freeware that is free only
for personal use is excluded for PL?

The term freeware, as used in this group, has always encompassed
software which is free only for personal use. What you suggest would
be a major change, and would certainly require a clear vote. I don't
see it happening.

Post by Aaron
If not, what's the point? It's useful information i agree, but the
ware glossary I would think was created for a distinct purpose- to
support PL elections, it's not meant to be a full taxonomy for
classification of software.

The point is entirely to useful information. The glossary is not only
'to support PL elections', it's to show what terms are used on the
a.c.f website and in the group; the later was the purpose for which is
was originally created.

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Aaron

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Dan Goodman
I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use" and
"free for noncommercial use."

Are you suggesting a change in the definition of Freeware? We don't say
anything that answers the question "free for who?" - perhaps we should.

Does that mean we will see a day where freeware that is free only for
personal use is excluded for PL?

If only one person meets the qualifications to use it is it "Freeware"?
*None* of the "who" limitations are addressed.

"Free for personal use" doesn't always mean *everybody* *everywhere*.
For example at one time AVG was free for personal use in North America
but not in Europe. WS_FTP changed from "free for personal use" to "free
for personal use if you're a student", IIRC some security apps are not
free for personal use everywhere in the world. . .

Post by Aaron
If not, what's the point? It's useful information i agree, but the ware
glossary I would think was created for a distinct purpose- to support PL
elections, it's not meant to be a full taxonomy for classification of
software.

FWIW the ware glossary was created as an aid to newsgroup discussion ->
to facilitate understanding and minimize newsgroup threads about the
*meaning* of various ware names "Well, when *I* say "Freeware" I mean. .
." ;)

Susan

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Susan Bugher
If only one person meets the qualifications to use it is it "Freeware"?
*None* of the "who" limitations are addressed.
"Free for personal use" doesn't always mean *everybody* *everywhere*.
For example at one time AVG was free for personal use in North America
but not in Europe. WS_FTP changed from "free for personal use" to "free
for personal use if you're a student", IIRC some security apps are not
free for personal use everywhere in the world. . .

Just tripped over one example of this type of licensing restriction -
dunno what/who is restricted - I didn't visit the MS link. . .

http://www.sysinternals.com/Licensing.html

</q>
Export Restrictions

The software is subject to United States export laws and regulations.
You must comply with all domestic and international export laws and
regulations that apply to the software. These laws include restrictions
on destinations, end users and end use. For additional information, see
www.microsoft.com/exporting .
</q>

Note: AFAICT they're lifted almost all the restrictions on commercial
use. The only restriction I see is "You may not. . . use the software
for commercial software hosting services."

Susan

[Bjorn Simonsen]

Post by Susan Bugher
For example at one time AVG was free for personal use in North America
but not in Europe.

Regionalware. Maybe we should just label all those "Freeware(R)"
(restricted freeware) "ConfusionWare" !? :)

[Aaron]

Post by Bjorn Simonsen

Post by Susan Bugher
For example at one time AVG was free for personal use in North America
but not in Europe.

Regionalware. Maybe we should just label all those "Freeware(R)"
(restricted freeware) "ConfusionWare" !? :)

Pretty much everything is confusionware. So that's not a useful label. :P

[Aaron]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Aaron

Post by Susan Bugher
Are you suggesting a change in the definition of Freeware? We don't
say anything that answers the question "free for who?" - perhaps we
should.

Does that mean we will see a day where freeware that is free only for
personal use is excluded for PL?

If only one person meets the qualifications to use it is it
"Freeware"? *None* of the "who" limitations are addressed.

Yes I think you are on to something, our ware types are not precisely
defined enough in this respect. We need to add more terms.

Post by Susan Bugher
"Free for personal use" doesn't always mean *everybody* *everywhere*.
For example at one time AVG was free for personal use in North America
but not in Europe. WS_FTP changed from "free for personal use" to
"free for personal use if you're a student", IIRC some security apps
are not free for personal use everywhere in the world. . .

Ah, so let's coin a few more terms then.

Regionware- Someone proposed this free for certain regions only
Studentware- free for students only
Occupationware- free for some occupations only.
Companyware- free only if you work in certain company.

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Aaron
If not, what's the point? It's useful information i agree, but the
ware glossary I would think was created for a distinct purpose- to
support PL elections, it's not meant to be a full taxonomy for
classification of software.

FWIW the ware glossary was created as an aid to newsgroup discussion
-> to facilitate understanding and minimize newsgroup threads about
the *meaning* of various ware names

Well that's pretty much the same thing really, since the final result is
to decide whether the software can be discussed here, and if it can't, it
most probably won't be in PL.

But go for it, I'm all for coining as many ware types as we can think of
based on whatever charateristic we can think of, then we can thumb our
noses at everyone else who doesn't accept our definition, go to wikipedia
and start fights because *we* clearly know better and how dare the rest
of the world disagree. :)


"Well, when *I* say "Freeware" I

Post by Susan Bugher
mean. . ." ;)

What's wrong with that? It's not as if the ware glossary has definitely
settled the debate on such issues. What's wrong with saying software X
does 1,2,3,4, I'm not sure if it fits into any of the arbitary boxes you
have tried to define...but if you wanted me to, it might be liteware or
maybe crippleware.

[Craig]

Post by Aaron

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be
useful (quote only the text you wish to revise if you are
proposing a revised definition).

I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any
use" and "free for noncommercial use."

Are you suggesting a change in the definition of Freeware? We don't
say anything that answers the question "free for who?" - perhaps we
should.

If not, what's the point? It's useful information i agree, but the
ware glossary I would think was created for a distinct purpose- to
support PL elections, it's not meant to be a full taxonomy for
classification of software.

Dan's suggestion would certainly make life easier for me and
others.

But, I can see Aaron's pov. Maybe we can avoid opening the
classifications can of worms by sticking to what acf'ers find most
useful. So, pulling from Aaron's post, it might be informative to put
up a poll on the importance to acf'ers of /other/ software

Post by Aaron
Within the freeware definition, please rate the importance of the
following (0-3 w/0 being "let's not do this, 1 being very important, 2 important,
free for commercial use
open source
free to redistribute
free to modify

(We could really even drop the last two since that's included in open
source licensing anyway.)

So...if this would be a large-ish headache, I say we shelve it and
depend on the program description for this kind of information. If
this wouldn't be a big process /and/ other people found this *very*
useful then...sure!

-Craig

[Dan Goodman]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be
useful (quote only the text you wish to revise if you are
proposing a revised definition).

I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use"
and "free for noncommercial use."

Are you suggesting a change in the definition of Freeware?

I didn't intend to.

We don't

Post by Susan Bugher
say anything that answers the question "free for who?" - perhaps we
should.
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php#Freeware
"Freeware: Legally obtainable software that you may use at no cost,
monetary or otherwise, for as long as you wish."
Susan

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Dan Goodman
I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use"
and "free for noncommercial use."

Are you suggesting a change in the definition of Freeware?

I didn't intend to.

Okay. FWIW the PL "about" pages have some info about licensing:

http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/2006/about2006PL.php

"Licensing restrictions are noted in the descriptions: "free for
personal use" etc. Other licensing information may be shown. For
example: "open source: GNU GPL" (the source code is available for use
and/or modification under the terms of the GNU General Public License)."

The ACF program info pages show the same info but IIRC we don't say that
anywhere. dunno if the ware glossary page is the best place to do that. . .

Also FWIW - on the PL and ACF pages I mostly show one of these
standardized descriptions (some older descriptions are more detailed):

(free)
(free for personal use)
(free for personal use/ non-commercial use)
(free for personal use/ some non-commercial uses)

Free is free for all. :) Free for non-commercial use includes
academic/educational use, charitable organizations. non-profits etc.

Susan

[Dan Goodman]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Dan Goodman

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Dan Goodman
I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any
use" and "free for noncommercial use."

Are you suggesting a change in the definition of Freeware?

I didn't intend to.

http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/2006/about2006PL.php
"Licensing restrictions are noted in the descriptions: "free for
personal use" etc. Other licensing information may be shown. For
example: "open source: GNU GPL" (the source code is available for use
and/or modification under the terms of the GNU General Public
License)."
The ACF program info pages show the same info but IIRC we don't say
that anywhere. dunno if the ware glossary page is the best place to
do that. . .
Also FWIW - on the PL and ACF pages I mostly show one of these
(free)
(free for personal use)
(free for personal use/ non-commercial use)
(free for personal use/ some non-commercial uses)
Free is free for all. :) Free for non-commercial use includes
academic/educational use, charitable organizations. non-profits etc.
Susan

Thanks!

[Bjorn Simonsen]

Dan Goodman wrote in

Post by Dan Goodman
I suggest something which distinguishes between "free for any use" and
"free for noncommercial use."

How about "Freeware(R)" or "R-Freeware" ?

R for "restricted", such as free for noncommercial use, or other
similar restrictions.

Or maybe we need to reserve the "R" for rated, say x-rated freeware?
Havent seen any yet, but who knows what's out there... 8-0

So, maybe "Restricted-ware" then? Too (re)strict(ed) perhaps?

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Bjorn Simonsen
How about "Freeware(R)" or "R-Freeware" ?
R for "restricted", such as free for noncommercial use, or other
similar restrictions.
Or maybe we need to reserve the "R" for rated, say x-rated freeware?
Havent seen any yet, but who knows what's out there... 8-0
So, maybe "Restricted-ware" then? Too (re)strict(ed) perhaps?

R U kidding? ;)

Susan

[Bjorn Simonsen]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Bjorn Simonsen
How about "Freeware(R)" or "R-Freeware" ?
R for "restricted", such as free for noncommercial use, or other
similar restrictions.
Or maybe we need to reserve the "R" for rated, say x-rated freeware?
Havent seen any yet, but who knows what's out there... 8-0
So, maybe "Restricted-ware" then? Too (re)strict(ed) perhaps?

R U kidding? ;)

Who me? Just trying to enter the matrix, the Freeware Matrix :)
How free is freeware, how open is open source?

See this video about open source:
http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/z/e/200606/ipodwmv/DB_OpenSource.wmv

Found at Zdnet "At the whiteboard"
http://news.zdnet.com/2036-2_22-5977423.html
(interesting colleciton of short video "lectures" by experts....)


All the best

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Bjorn Simonsen

Post by Susan Bugher
R U kidding? ;)

Who me? Just trying to enter the matrix, the Freeware Matrix :)
How free is freeware, how open is open source?

Go baby, go!

Post by Bjorn Simonsen
http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/z/e/200606/ipodwmv/DB_OpenSource.wmv
Found at Zdnet "At the whiteboard"
http://news.zdnet.com/2036-2_22-5977423.html
(interesting colleciton of short video "lectures" by experts....)

Thanks a lot for torturing this poor soul (who is beginning to think she
may be the last person on earth who doesn't have a fast connection) with
video links.

Susan

[Bjorn Simonsen]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Bjorn Simonsen
http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/z/e/200606/ipodwmv/DB_OpenSource.wmv

Thanks a lot for torturing this poor soul (who is beginning to think she
may be the last person on earth who doesn't have a fast connection) with
video links.

Ouch, I forgot! No harm or torture intended!

Oh well, don't worry, I will e-mail it to you!! (*). It is only 5,6mb,
and mime encoding will only inflate the size by some 30-40%!


(*): just kidding :->

[Ocean]

Post by Susan Bugher
Ware Glossary - Annual Review
Requestware: you are asked to do something. Examples: send a
postcard or email to the software author, perform a good deed, make a
contribution to charity

Cardware (Postcardware): a style of software distribution similar to
shareware, distributed by the author on the condition that users send
the author a postcard. You must mail the author a postcard in order to
get a registration code. Emailware uses the same approach but requires
the user to send the author an email.

Emailware: a style of software distribution similar to shareware,
distributed by the author on the condition that users send the author an
email. You must email the author in order to get a registration code.
Cardware (Postcardware) uses the same approach but requires the user to
send the author a postcard.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postcardware

[Vegard Krog Petersen]

Post by Ocean

Post by Susan Bugher
Ware Glossary - Annual Review
Requestware: you are asked to do something. Examples: send a
postcard or email to the software author, perform a good deed, make a
contribution to charity

Perhaps rephrase to something like this : you are asked to do semething
(but it is not compulsory).

To distinguish it from the entries below ???

Post by Ocean
Cardware (Postcardware): a style of software distribution similar to
shareware, distributed by the author on the condition that users send
the author a postcard. You must mail the author a postcard in order to
get a registration code. Emailware uses the same approach but requires
the user to send the author an email.
Emailware: a style of software distribution similar to shareware,
distributed by the author on the condition that users send the author an
email. You must email the author in order to get a registration code.
Cardware (Postcardware) uses the same approach but requires the user to
send the author a postcard.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postcardware

regards from
--
Vegard Krog Petersen - Norway

http://vegard2.no -
Solitaire MahJongg guide, Sarah Michelle Gellar Solitaire,
Freeware Logo & symbol, Halma & Chinese Checkers,
Pachisi & Ludo, Freeware Solitaire, My fishy site (fishing
games), a.c.f.g information, Fredrikshald Havfiskeklubb
18+ sites: Firefoxy, Adult Solitaire, Fishy Pictures,
Sexy Chess, Sexy Librarians, Sexy Football
---------------------------------------------------------

[Ocean]

Post by Vegard Krog Petersen

Post by Ocean

Post by Susan Bugher
Ware Glossary - Annual Review
Requestware: you are asked to do something. Examples: send a
postcard or email to the software author, perform a good deed, make a
contribution to charity

Perhaps rephrase to something like this : you are asked to do semething
(but it is not compulsory).
To distinguish it from the entries below ???

Post by Ocean
Cardware (Postcardware): a style of software distribution similar to
shareware, distributed by the author on the condition that users send
the author a postcard. You must mail the author a postcard in order to
get a registration code. Emailware uses the same approach but requires
the user to send the author an email.
Emailware: a style of software distribution similar to shareware,
distributed by the author on the condition that users send the author
an email. You must email the author in order to get a registration
code. Cardware (Postcardware) uses the same approach but requires the
user to send the author a postcard.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postcardware

regards from

Thanks.

Requestware is probably optional.

Cardware and Emailware are probably not optional if that's the only way
to register the program and unlock all features. However, they may be
optional to get addons or bonuses. Some people will want the
addons/bonuses but others will not.

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Vegard Krog Petersen

Post by Ocean

Post by Susan Bugher
Requestware: you are asked to do something. Examples: send a
postcard or email to the software author, perform a good deed, make a
contribution to charity

Perhaps rephrase to something like this : you are asked to do semething
(but it is not compulsory).

IMO that's redundant. Requested *is* non-compulsory (required is
cumpulsory).

Post by Vegard Krog Petersen
To distinguish it from the entries below ???

Post by Ocean
Cardware (Postcardware): a style of software distribution similar to
shareware, distributed by the author on the condition that users send
the author a postcard. You must mail the author a postcard in order to
get a registration code. Emailware uses the same approach but requires
the user to send the author an email.
Emailware: a style of software distribution similar to shareware,
distributed by the author on the condition that users send the author
an email. You must email the author in order to get a registration
code. Cardware (Postcardware) uses the same approach but requires the
user to send the author a postcard.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postcardware

Susan

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Ocean

Post by Susan Bugher
Ware Glossary - Annual Review
Requestware: you are asked to do something. Examples: send a
postcard or email to the software author, perform a good deed, make a
contribution to charity

Do you want to revise or remove this definition (IOW why did you include
it in your post)?

Post by Ocean
Cardware (Postcardware): a style of software distribution similar to
shareware, distributed by the author on the condition that users send
the author a postcard. You must mail the author a postcard in order to
get a registration code. Emailware uses the same approach but requires
the user to send the author an email.
Emailware: a style of software distribution similar to shareware,
distributed by the author on the condition that users send the author an
email. You must email the author in order to get a registration code.
Cardware (Postcardware) uses the same approach but requires the user to
send the author a postcard.

Why do we need ware descriptions for Cardware (Postcardware) and
Emailware? ISTM labeling such apps "Requestware" in newsgroup posts and
on the ACF and PL pages conveys the information that's of interest to
the reader.

http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php#Registerware
"Requestware: you are asked to do something. Examples: send a postcard
or email to the software author, perform a good deed, make a
contribution to charity."

Susan

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Ocean
Cardware (Postcardware): a style of software distribution similar to
shareware, distributed by the author on the condition that users send
the author a postcard. You must mail the author a postcard in order to
get a registration code. Emailware uses the same approach but requires
the user to send the author an email.
Emailware: a style of software distribution similar to shareware,
distributed by the author on the condition that users send the author
an email. You must email the author in order to get a registration
code. Cardware (Postcardware) uses the same approach but requires the
user to send the author a postcard.

Why do we need ware descriptions for Cardware (Postcardware) and
Emailware? ISTM labeling such apps "Requestware" in newsgroup posts and
on the ACF and PL pages conveys the information that's of interest to
the reader.
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php#Registerware
"Requestware: you are asked to do something. Examples: send a postcard
or email to the software author, perform a good deed, make a
contribution to charity."

Oops, I missed the key point -> registration codes. If you need a
registration code the app is Registerware:

http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php#Registerware
"Registerware: you must provide personal information via registration in
order to download and/or use the program."

Susan

[Aaron]

Post by Susan Bugher
Oops, I missed the key point -> registration codes. If you need a

I think this brings up an interesting point, should we coin seperate names
for waretypes that belong to 2 or more existing categories?

For example what if something is liteware until you request a registeration
code via email?

[Bjorn Simonsen]

Post by Aaron
I think this brings up an interesting point, should we coin seperate names
for waretypes that belong to 2 or more existing categories?
For example what if something is liteware until you request a registeration
code via email?

Coverd if adding "full" to existing registerware def?

Registerware: you must provide personal information via
registration in order to download and/or use the FULL program

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Bjorn Simonsen

Post by Aaron
I think this brings up an interesting point, should we coin seperate names
for waretypes that belong to 2 or more existing categories?

<yawn> read the glossary. . .

http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php
"Several ware types may be used when describing a program (for example:
Donationware and Liteware and Betaware). "

Post by Bjorn Simonsen

Post by Aaron
For example what if something is liteware until you request a registeration
code via email?

Example? I can't think of an app that behaves that way. . .

Post by Bjorn Simonsen
Coverd if adding "full" to existing registerware def?
Registerware: you must provide personal information via
registration in order to download and/or use the FULL program

erm. . . doesn't that create a new problem? Lots of Liteware requires
registration before you can use it at all. Liteware is not "the FULL
program".

Susan

[Aaron]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Bjorn Simonsen

Post by Aaron
I think this brings up an interesting point, should we coin seperate
names for waretypes that belong to 2 or more existing categories?

<yawn> read the glossary. . .
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php
"Several ware types may be used when describing a program (for
example: Donationware and Liteware and Betaware). "

Of course I know that. My point is whether a single name is need so we
can be more concise when talking about it. Why say betaware and Liteware,
where we can say betalightware!

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Bjorn Simonsen
Coverd if adding "full" to existing registerware def?
Registerware: you must provide personal information via
registration in order to download and/or use the FULL program

erm. . . doesn't that create a new problem? Lots of Liteware requires
registration before you can use it at all. Liteware is not "the FULL
program".

Hmm I think there are 2 opposing views here with regards to taxonomy.

[Ocean]

Post by Susan Bugher
Ware Glossary - Annual Review
Adware: software that displays advertising for other products
and/or services (often downloaded from the internet by the software)..
Malware: software that contains malicious programming
Spyware: software that sends information about you and your
computer to others (usually without your knowledge and consent). Spyware
may also install files on your hard drive without your knowledge.

Bundleware: software that contains bundled Adware or Spyware. BundleWare
provides a means to help distribute adware or spyware via a bundled
solution. The adware or spyware may be part of the main program or may
be a separate program added to the Setup installer that functions
independently of the main program. In some cases the main program will
not function if the adware is removed, or will not install unless the
adware is installed. Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or
"opt out" capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted
extras by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation
prompts. Unsafe Bundleware does not provide this choice and after
infecting your computer, continues to download other viruses, worms,
trojans, and other parasites onto your computer, without your knowledge
or consent.



http://www.spywareremove.com/removeBundleware.html
http://www.safer-networking.com/removeBundleware.php

"Bundleware is spyware that, after infecting your computer, continues to
download other viruses, worms, Trojans, etc.
Bundleware is always a security risk because it downloads other
parasites onto your computer, without your knowledge or consent."

http://research.sunbelt-software.com/threatdisplay.aspx?name=BundleWare&threatid=14991

"BundleWare provides a means to help distribute spyware or adware via a
bundled solution."

"An Adware Bundler is a downloadable program that is typically
"freeware" because it is bundled with advertising software -- adware.
The adware may function independently of the bundler program, but in
some cases the bundler program will not function if the adware is
removed, or will not install unless the adware is installed. Most Adware
Bundlers install several adware applications from multiple adware
vendors, each of which is governed by a separate End User License
Agreement (EULA) and Privacy Policy. Some Adware Bundlers may not fully
and properly disclose the presence of bundled advertising software
during installation."

http://www.noadware.net/research/index2.php?item_id=697&item_name=Bundleware

"Assists with bundling of various applications, which can and do include
spyware and adware applications."

[Ocean]

Post by Ocean

Post by Susan Bugher
Ware Glossary - Annual Review
Adware: software that displays advertising for other products
and/or services (often downloaded from the internet by the software)..
Malware: software that contains malicious programming
Spyware: software that sends information about you and your
computer to others (usually without your knowledge and consent).
Spyware may also install files on your hard drive without your knowledge.

Bundleware: software that contains bundled Adware or Spyware. BundleWare
provides a means to help distribute adware or spyware via a bundled
solution. The adware or spyware may be part of the main program or may
be a separate program added to the Setup installer that functions
independently of the main program. In some cases the main program will
not function if the adware is removed, or will not install unless the
adware is installed. Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or
"opt out" capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted
extras by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation
prompts. Unsafe Bundleware does not provide this choice and after
infecting your computer, continues to download other viruses, worms,
trojans, and other parasites onto your computer, without your knowledge
or consent.

Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or "opt out"
capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted extras
(by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation
prompts). Or, the "optional components" can be disabled/removed after
installation (by settings, preferences, or other means).

[Aaron]

Post by Ocean

Post by Ocean
Bundleware: software that contains bundled Adware or Spyware.
BundleWare provides a means to help distribute adware or spyware via
a bundled solution. The adware or spyware may be part of the main
program

I think if the adware/spyware is "part of the main program" it should not
be considered bundleware.

What after all is the difference between 100% adware and so called
bundleware where adware is part of the main program?

Because Bundleware uses third party adware components? What counts as
third party?

I suppose we could hash that all out, but I rather we focus our attention
on aspects that we can all do something about (opt out) than to discuss
other hard to quantify factors.

Does the user really care that a certain app is bundleware if he can't do
anything about the adware part? You might as well call it adware and be
done with it.

or may be a separate program added to the Setup installer

Post by Ocean

Post by Ocean
that functions independently of the main program.

In some cases the

Post by Ocean

Post by Ocean
main program will not function if the adware is removed, or will not
install unless the adware is installed. Safe Bundleware provides
"optional installation" or "opt out" capability, so the user can
choose not to install the unwanted extras by checking or unchecking
boxes/buttons during the installation prompts.

I don't like the idea of using adjectives like "safe". How about
bundleware with optional components.

Post by Ocean
Safe Bundleware
Or, the "optional components" can be disabled/removed after
installation (by settings, preferences, or other means).

Hmm this one's a bit tricky. What type of removal methods count? If I use
spybot and it removes only the spyware component while allowing
everything to work is it then "optional" ?


To summarise we have

1) Bundleware (normal) : Software bundled with adware/spyware components
that you can't do anything about. You either take the package as a whole
or you don't.

I personally think you might as well call this adware, spyware *since you
can't do anything about it*. Definitely not acceptable for PL.

2) Bundleware (opt out at point of install) : Software bundled with
adware components that you can choose not to install.

IMHO not adware, acceptable in PL.

3)Bundleware (allows disable/opt out after install)

I don't quite trust this one. Because I forsee we will get into debates
on whether what really counts as being able to disable the component
(must it be something within the program interface? What about merely
add/remove programs?), whether the component is really fully disabled
etc.

Luckily this one doesn't seem that common?

[Bear Bottoms]

On Sun, 10 Sep 2006 09:10:25 -0500, Aaron

Post by Aaron
To summarise we have
1) Bundleware (normal) : Software bundled with adware/spyware components
that you can't do anything about. You either take the package as a whole
or you don't.
I personally think you might as well call this adware, spyware *since you
can't do anything about it*. Definitely not acceptable for PL.
2) Bundleware (opt out at point of install) : Software bundled with
adware components that you can choose not to install.
IMHO not adware, acceptable in PL.
3)Bundleware (allows disable/opt out after install)
I don't quite trust this one. Because I forsee we will get into debates
on whether what really counts as being able to disable the component
(must it be something within the program interface? What about merely
add/remove programs?), whether the component is really fully disabled
etc.
Luckily this one doesn't seem that common?

Clearly unfettered software with anything beyond a programs necessary
function is most desired and software with "program purity" should be
given the highest consideration.

All of the rest should be severely critisized and categorized seperate.
This is the only way we have to fight it.

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Aaron
I personally think you might as well call this adware, spyware *since you
can't do anything about it*. Definitely not acceptable for PL.
IMHO not adware, acceptable in PL.

The ware glossary discussion is about ware definitions. Elegibility for
the PL should be discussed in the the PL thread.

These definitions comes close to my understanding of the meaning of bundled:

http://www.tjiss.net/glossary_b.html
"Bundled
Refers to the practice of automatically including an additional
application or capability in the sale or delivery of a computing
component that is not ordinarily associated with that component."

http://spyware.remove-spyware.com/definitions2.htm
"Bundled
An arrangement in which one or more software programs are included with
another program, for technical reasons or because of a business
partnership. Many instances of spyware installations come through bundling."

I propose this for an ACF definition of Bundleware:
Bundleware: Additional applications are included in the delivery of a
program.

Susan

[»Q«]

Post by Susan Bugher
Bundleware: Additional applications are included in the delivery
of a program.

That seems concise and clear to me. I'd change "a program" to "the
program", only because that's how most of the other definitions in
the glossary are phrased.

[Susan Bugher]

Post by »Q«

Post by Susan Bugher
Bundleware: Additional applications are included in the delivery
of a program.

That seems concise and clear to me. I'd change "a program" to "the
program", only because that's how most of the other definitions in
the glossary are phrased.

Okay by me. My *proposed* definition is now:

Bundleware: Additional applications are included in the delivery
of the program.

ATM I believe we have two proposed definitions for Bundleware. I'll add
the second one here as an aid to further discussion. Ocean has proposed
this definition for Bundleware:

Bundleware: software that contains bundled Adware or Spyware. BundleWare
provides a means to help distribute adware or spyware via a bundled
solution. The adware or spyware may be part of the main program or may
be a separate program added to the Setup installer that functions
independently of the main program. In some cases the main program will
not function if the adware is removed, or will not install unless the
adware is installed. Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or
"opt out" capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted
extras by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation
prompts. Unsafe Bundleware does not provide this choice and after
infecting your computer, continues to download other viruses, worms,
trojans, and other parasites onto your computer, without your knowledge
or consent.

*EVERYBODY*

Please *label* proposed additions/revisions as such -> to distinguish
them from information/comments etc. (ATM I'm having some difficulty
telling which is which.)

Please post if you support one of the above Bundleware definitions or
have comments/ revisions etc. to offer.

Susan

[Nicolaas Hawkins]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by »Q«

Post by Susan Bugher
Bundleware: Additional applications are included in the delivery
of a program.

That seems concise and clear to me. I'd change "a program" to "the
program", only because that's how most of the other definitions in
the glossary are phrased.

Bundleware: Additional applications are included in the delivery
of the program.
ATM I believe we have two proposed definitions for Bundleware. I'll add
the second one here as an aid to further discussion. Ocean has proposed
Bundleware: software that contains bundled Adware or Spyware. BundleWare
provides a means to help distribute adware or spyware via a bundled
solution. The adware or spyware may be part of the main program or may
be a separate program added to the Setup installer that functions
independently of the main program. In some cases the main program will
not function if the adware is removed, or will not install unless the
adware is installed. Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or
"opt out" capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted
extras by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation
prompts. Unsafe Bundleware does not provide this choice and after
infecting your computer, continues to download other viruses, worms,
trojans, and other parasites onto your computer, without your knowledge
or consent.
*EVERYBODY*
Please *label* proposed additions/revisions as such -> to distinguish
them from information/comments etc. (ATM I'm having some difficulty
telling which is which.)
Please post if you support one of the above Bundleware definitions or
have comments/ revisions etc. to offer.
Susan

I support the definition of "bundleware" as proposed by Ocean, with the
reservation that I believe a more appropriate word than "solution" could
be used in the second sentence. It sounds a little "marketing hype"-ish.
Perhaps the more prosaic "software package" would serve? (and at the same
time be more accurate)

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Nicolaas Hawkins

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by »Q«

Post by Susan Bugher
Bundleware: Additional applications are included in the delivery
of a program.

That seems concise and clear to me. I'd change "a program" to "the
program", only because that's how most of the other definitions in
the glossary are phrased.

Bundleware: Additional applications are included in the delivery
of the program.
ATM I believe we have two proposed definitions for Bundleware. I'll add
the second one here as an aid to further discussion. Ocean has proposed
Bundleware: software that contains bundled Adware or Spyware. BundleWare
provides a means to help distribute adware or spyware via a bundled
solution. The adware or spyware may be part of the main program or may
be a separate program added to the Setup installer that functions
independently of the main program. In some cases the main program will
not function if the adware is removed, or will not install unless the
adware is installed. Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or
"opt out" capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted
extras by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation
prompts. Unsafe Bundleware does not provide this choice and after
infecting your computer, continues to download other viruses, worms,
trojans, and other parasites onto your computer, without your knowledge
or consent.
*EVERYBODY*
Please *label* proposed additions/revisions as such -> to distinguish
them from information/comments etc. (ATM I'm having some difficulty
telling which is which.)
Please post if you support one of the above Bundleware definitions or
have comments/ revisions etc. to offer.
Susan

I support the definition of "bundleware" as proposed by Ocean, with the
reservation that I believe a more appropriate word than "solution" could
be used in the second sentence. It sounds a little "marketing hype"-ish.
Perhaps the more prosaic "software package" would serve? (and at the same
time be more accurate)

The first sentence of Ocean's defintion is: "Bundleware: software that
contains bundled Adware or Spyware." That *excludes* bundles that don't
contain Adware or Spyware. What do we call those? ISTM if Adware/Spyware
is mentioned in a Bundleware definition is should be mentioned as
something that MAY be included or is OFTEN included or some such
language. . .

A few examples of NON-Spyware/Adware bundles (all taken from this year's
PL):

CCleaner (Crap Cleaner)
(Donationware) (free) standard version is bundled with Yahoo's IE
Toolbar (installation is optional).

IrfanView
(free for personal use/non-commercial use) bundled with toolbars
(installation is optional)

JR Screen Ruler
(Liteware) (free) bundled with the $ware version

Susan

[Ocean]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Nicolaas Hawkins
I support the definition of "bundleware" as proposed by Ocean, with the
reservation that I believe a more appropriate word than "solution" could
be used in the second sentence. It sounds a little "marketing hype"-ish.
Perhaps the more prosaic "software package" would serve? (and at the same
time be more accurate)

The first sentence of Ocean's defintion is: "Bundleware: software that
contains bundled Adware or Spyware." That *excludes* bundles that don't
contain Adware or Spyware. What do we call those? ISTM if Adware/Spyware
is mentioned in a Bundleware definition is should be mentioned as
something that MAY be included or is OFTEN included or some such
language. . .
Susan

Bundleware: Bundleware: software that often contains bundled Adware or
Spyware. BundleWare provides a means to help distribute adware or
spyware via a bundled software package. The adware or spyware may be
part of the main program or may be a separate program added to the Setup
installer that functions independently of the main program. In some
cases the main program will not function if the adware is removed, or
will not install unless the adware is installed. Safe Bundleware
provides "optional installation" or "opt out" capability, so the user
can choose not to install the unwanted extras by checking or unchecking
boxes/buttons during the installation prompts. Unsafe Bundleware does
not provide this choice and after infecting your computer, continues to
download other viruses, worms, trojans, and other parasites onto your
computer, without your knowledge or consent.

[Ron May]

Post by Ocean
Bundleware: Bundleware: software that often contains bundled Adware or
Spyware. BundleWare provides a means to help distribute adware or
spyware via a bundled software package. The adware or spyware may be
part of the main program or may be a separate program added to the Setup
installer that functions independently of the main program. In some
cases the main program will not function if the adware is removed, or
will not install unless the adware is installed. Safe Bundleware
provides "optional installation" or "opt out" capability, so the user
can choose not to install the unwanted extras by checking or unchecking
boxes/buttons during the installation prompts. Unsafe Bundleware does
not provide this choice and after infecting your computer, continues to
download other viruses, worms, trojans, and other parasites onto your
computer, without your knowledge or consent.

Piggybacking on your work, I think this covers most of what you wrote
in a slightly smaller version (8 lines vs 13):

Bundleware: Software that is packaged to install other software with
the main program, sometimes Adware or Spyware. The Adware, Spyware or
other software may be part of the main program or may be a separate
program that functions independently. Some Bundleware allows the user
to "opt out" from installing unwanted extras by using checkboxes or
buttons. Other Bundleware does not allow the user to "opt-out" and/or
will not function if the unwanted extras are removed or disabled. Some
Bundleware may also be Malware.

Comments? (Can it be made shorter?)

[B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson]

On Mon, 11 Sep 2006 22:25:00 -0400, Susan Bugher wrote:

[2 Suggestions for Bundleware definition]

Post by Susan Bugher
Please post if you support one of the above Bundleware definitions or
have comments/ revisions etc. to offer.

I'm not too happy with both definitions. Your suggestion seems a bit
unspecific. It, IMHO, also addresses tool packages, for instance.
The version proposed by Ocean, OTOH, contains to much descriptions
as to be a striking definition (for my taste). Being very specific,
it moreover seems to cover too few programs we might want to flag.

I have two other suggestions. One shows a broad approach, addressing
all kinds of bundles. The second will make Bundleware a term for
identifying unwanted bundling, only. The latter approach might be
more helpful for the PL process, but may lead to confusion when used
in discussions with people which have a more general notion of
Bundleware. That's why I, myself, prefer the first one.

Suggestion I:
Bundleware: Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often
unsolicited) separable software.
Suggestion II:
Bundleware: Software accompanied by unsolicited, yet separable
software.

I didn't include that the program itself has to provide means to
forgo the activation of the bundle. The distinguishing feature of
Bundleware is the clear division between program and bundle. All
further characteristics are just variations, which tend to become
blurred, the more programs are examined.

The actual kind of Bundleware should be mentioned inside program
definitions, while the definition is kept clean and simple. OTOH,
markers like "Bundleware (opt-in)" / "Bundleware (deactivation
after install possible)" / ... are fine with me.

BeAr

[Ron May]

On Wed, 13 Sep 2006 11:23:19 +0200, "B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson"

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
Bundleware: Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often
unsolicited) separable software.
The actual kind of Bundleware should be mentioned inside program
definitions, while the definition is kept clean and simple. OTOH,
markers like "Bundleware (opt-in)" / "Bundleware (deactivation
after install possible)" / ... are fine with me.

I think you nailed it. Short and to the point, as are most other
Glossary entries.

[Craig]

Post by Ron May
On Wed, 13 Sep 2006 11:23:19 +0200, "B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson"

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
Bundleware: Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often
unsolicited) separable software.

...

Post by Ron May
I think you nailed it. Short and to the point, as are most other
Glossary entries.

I like it. And it works to flag comodo at least.

-Craig

[Aaron]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
I have two other suggestions. One shows a broad approach, addressing
all kinds of bundles. The second will make Bundleware a term for
identifying unwanted bundling, only. The latter approach might be
more helpful for the PL process,

Yes. It depends on what exactly we are creating the taxonomy of ware
types for. Remember we are not dividing software into essential classes,
but rather how we intend to the use the ware glossary should guide the
way we classify.


but may lead to confusion when used

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
in discussions with people which have a more general notion of
Bundleware. That's why I, myself, prefer the first one.
Bundleware: Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often
unsolicited) separable software.
Bundleware: Software accompanied by unsolicited, yet separable
software.

How about a hierachy of bundleware types from most general to most
specific?

At the most general level we can talk about being bundled with
"substantially distinct" software. Altough I think the phasing is a bit
vague on what really constitutes substantially distinct.

At the next level we talk about unsoclicited/unwanted software which
typically translates to adware/spyware being bundled. This is of interest
to people.

Next we distinguish between those that can be opted out or not .

At the last level, we talk about how they can be opted out (prior to
installation or after).

[Susan Bugher]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
[2 Suggestions for Bundleware definition]

Post by Susan Bugher
Please post if you support one of the above Bundleware definitions or
have comments/ revisions etc. to offer.

I'm not too happy with both definitions. Your suggestion seems a bit
unspecific. It, IMHO, also addresses tool packages, for instance.

Good point. I think most people use "package" or "collection" to
describe such software bundles. Labeling them as Bundleware seems
misleading to me -> we need a way to exclude them from the definition.

FWIW some tool collections are listed on the ACF pages here:
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/P_SYSTEMUTILITIES.php#1.01ToolCollection

I proposed (and now withdraw the proposal):
"Bundleware: Additional applications are included in the delivery
of the program."

You proposed (Suggestion I):
"Bundleware: Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often
unsolicited) separable software."

Software packages/collections are a number of distinct or substantially
distinct apps. IMO your definition doesn't clarify the distinction
between a package/collection of apps and bundled software.. . .

I propose:
"Bundleware: Additional applications (usually undesired) are included in
the delivery of the program or collection of programs)."

still seems a bit fuzzy. . . :(

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
The version proposed by Ocean, OTOH, contains to much descriptions
as to be a striking definition (for my taste). Being very specific,
it moreover seems to cover too few programs we might want to flag.
I have two other suggestions. One shows a broad approach, addressing
all kinds of bundles. The second will make Bundleware a term for
identifying unwanted bundling, only. The latter approach might be
more helpful for the PL process, but may lead to confusion when used
in discussions with people which have a more general notion of
Bundleware. That's why I, myself, prefer the first one.
Bundleware: Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often
unsolicited) separable software.
Bundleware: Software accompanied by unsolicited, yet separable
software.
I didn't include that the program itself has to provide means to
forgo the activation of the bundle. The distinguishing feature of
Bundleware is the clear division between program and bundle. All
further characteristics are just variations, which tend to become
blurred, the more programs are examined.
The actual kind of Bundleware should be mentioned inside program
definitions, while the definition is kept clean and simple. OTOH,
markers like "Bundleware (opt-in)" / "Bundleware (deactivation
after install possible)" / ... are fine with me.

ISTM another way to handle this would be to define "software bundle"
rather than "Bundleware". A "software bundle" could be defined in the
section at the top of the page where we define "software". (The existing
ACF and PL ware descriptions wouldn't need to be changed if we use that
approach.)

Susan

[B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson]

Post by Susan Bugher
Software packages/collections are a number of distinct or substantially
distinct apps. IMO your definition doesn't clarify the distinction
between a package/collection of apps and bundled software.. . .

I don't think so. Within a package or collection you have no reference
application against which you can compare other tools. Else it would be
an application bundled with tools. Therefore, a collection is itself
Software (as a whole), which might be bundled with other software,
substantially different from that base collection. If the latter would
be the case, even a collection could be Bundleware. In other words:
A collection can only be regarded as Bundleware if it contains a
substantially different kind of software. By my definition.

BeAr

[Susan Bugher]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson

Post by Susan Bugher
Software packages/collections are a number of distinct or substantially
distinct apps. IMO your definition doesn't clarify the distinction
between a package/collection of apps and bundled software.. . .

I don't think so. Within a package or collection you have no reference
application against which you can compare other tools. Else it would be
an application bundled with tools. Therefore, a collection is itself
Software (as a whole), which might be bundled with other software,
substantially different from that base collection. If the latter would
A collection can only be regarded as Bundleware if it contains a
substantially different kind of software. By my definition.

A collection of apps certainly can be described as a bundle without
distorting the meaning of bundle. The glossary will be used by people
who have an idea of the meaning of bundle but aren't aware of the
*special* way "bundle" is used in software terminology.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=bundle&x=50&y=10
1. several objects or a quantity of material gathered or bound together:
a bundle of hay.
2. an item, group, or quantity wrapped for carrying; package.
3.a number of things considered together: a bundle of ideas.
<SNIP>

re "contains a substantially different kind of software" - I disagree

IMO this app should be labeled *Bundleware*:
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/2006/PL2006GRAPHICS.php#3374-PW
JR Screen Ruler
(Liteware) (free) bundled with the $ware version

Susan

[B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson]

Post by Susan Bugher
re "contains a substantially different kind of software" - I disagree
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/2006/PL2006GRAPHICS.php#3374-PW
JR Screen Ruler
(Liteware) (free) bundled with the $ware version

You don't regard a Payware version of a program not "a substantially
different kind of software" compared to the Freeware??? I certainly do!

BeAr

[Susan Bugher]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson

Post by Susan Bugher
re "contains a substantially different kind of software" - I disagree
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/2006/PL2006GRAPHICS.php#3374-PW
JR Screen Ruler
(Liteware) (free) bundled with the $ware version

You don't regard a Payware version of a program not "a substantially
different kind of software" compared to the Freeware??? I certainly do!

FWIW I'd call it as a Payware version of the same kind of software.

Susan

[B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson]

Post by Susan Bugher
FWIW I'd call it as a Payware version of the same kind of software.

Looking long enough, you may find similarities and differences on all
things. If two programs were compiled yesterday (an office suite and
a tray clock) then - besides both being Windows applications (and
therefore are already very alike) - both are also the same kind of
software, namely "very recent software".

In choosing between a 5 star hotel and a free accommodation I also
don't usually call them the same, only because both let me sleep
somewhere.

No. Freeware and Payware versions are very different software,
even when fulfilling the same task. And still, if both are
identical to the last byte.

The PC-Mag utilities on my disk, for instance, are very different
from the same versions still on the Net. I rightfully can use the
former, but I would have to pay to get them again. - Because of
the change of the licensing scheme...

BeAr

[Susan Bugher]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson

Post by Susan Bugher
FWIW I'd call it as a Payware version of the same kind of software.

Looking long enough, you may find similarities and differences on all
things. If two programs were compiled yesterday (an office suite and
a tray clock) then - besides both being Windows applications (and
therefore are already very alike) - both are also the same kind of
software, namely "very recent software".
In choosing between a 5 star hotel and a free accommodation I also
don't usually call them the same, only because both let me sleep
somewhere.
No. Freeware and Payware versions are very different software,
even when fulfilling the same task. And still, if both are
identical to the last byte.
The PC-Mag utilities on my disk, for instance, are very different
from the same versions still on the Net. I rightfully can use the
former, but I would have to pay to get them again. - Because of
the change of the licensing scheme...

The concern is to create ware definitions that are easy to apply and as
unambiguous as possible. IMO our differing opinions are to the point
only in the sense that they highlight a possible problem/ ambiguity in
your proposed definition. Maybe that's just me. Let's see if others feel
your meaning is clear.

Susan

[B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson

Post by Susan Bugher
Software packages/collections are a number of distinct or substantially
distinct apps. IMO your definition doesn't clarify the distinction
between a package/collection of apps and bundled software.. . .

[...]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
A collection can only be regarded as Bundleware if it contains a
substantially different kind of software. By my definition.

And it is important, under which label some software travels. Let's
say, Notepad++ came with UnxUtils. Than it would be a bundle of
Notepad++ with sth. else. The same bundle from the UnxUtils site
under the label UnxUtils would be a bundle of UnxUtils with sth.
else.

If a plugin for Notepad++ would be distributed with the whole editor,
it still would be Bundleware. The other way round, OTOH, it would
just be Notepad++ including a plugin; but not Bundleware. - Because
a plugin is just a (minor) extension of the main program and not
a "substantially distinct" kind of software.

Just a cause of the label, under which the software sails...

That's why, "distinct" refers to the application(s), which are the
core of the whole bunch. Which is defined not the least by the label
attached by the author/distributor.

Packages and collections are (usually) named as such and are
therefore to be looked at as a whole.

Btw.:
If my first example (Notepad++ and UnxUtils) would be distributed
as "Core Freeware System Extension 1", it would again be a package
and not a bundle. If distributed as "Best Of Command Line 1", the
negligible command line capabilities of Notepad++ (compared to
its main features) would make that package a bundle.

And so on... ;-)

BeAr

[Ocean]

Post by Susan Bugher
Ware Glossary - Annual Review
Commercial Software: software that is sold.
Demoware: software that is intended to give potential purchasers
an idea of how the program works. Not a full version, type of limitation
varies.
Freeware: Legally obtainable software that you may use at no
cost, monetary or otherwise, for as long as you wish.
Shareware: commercial software that can be downloaded. Payment
is required for legal use of the software. Some authors use the honor
system, more commonly code is included to prevent the use of some or all
functions if payment is not made in accordance with the shareware agreement.
Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time
or number of uses.

Demoware: software that is intended to give potential purchasers an idea
of how the program works. It is a more restrictive form of trialware,
so you may not be able to test or evaluate all features. Not a full
version, type of limitation varies.

Expireware: Software with a built-in expiration date or time, which
stops working on a specific calendar date or after a certain number of
days, minutes or uses. Unlike some forms of shareware and trialware,
expireware cannot be used at all after the expiration date.

Shareware: commercial software that can be downloaded, often for free.
Payment is required for legal use of the software beyond the trial
period. Some authors use the honor system (unrestricted shareware); more
commonly, code is included to prevent the use of some or all functions
(trialware/expireware) if payment is not made in accordance with the
shareware agreement.

Trialware: A trial is, in the most general sense, a test, usually a test
to see whether something does or does not meet a given standard.
Trialware is a form of shareware, software that you can test, evaluate,
and "try before you buy". The software stops working completely or turns
into a limited free version (freeware, liteware or crippleware) after a
period of time or number of uses. To enable all features and remove
restrictions after the trial period is over, you must purchase
(register, unlock, and/or activate) the program.


One trial version expired after 40 minutes of use. That's why I put
minutes in there.

Even free software can expire (RegCool, Microsoft Antispyware). These
don't (didn't) meet the current definition of freeware because you can't
(couldn't) use them for as long as you wish, but they are (were) free
and legally obtainable at no cost.

http://computing-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/expireware
http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Trialware

[Ron May]

Post by Susan Bugher
Ware Glossary - Annual Review
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php

Glossary seems pretty good as is. Making subcategories ("free for
personal use only," or "cardware" and "emailware") is, as you
suggested, best handled in the program descriptions and elsewhere
rather than adding Glossary items.

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Susan Bugher
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php

There seems to be a general consensus in ACF that programs that expire
and can be renewed are not Trialware. I think perhaps that should be
spelled out. Our current definition is:

"Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time or
number of uses."

I propose this revised definition:

"Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time or
number of uses. Programs that can be reactivated without payment are not
considered Trialware."

dunno if that's the best way to say it. Suggestions please. . .

Susan

[Ron May]

Post by Susan Bugher
There seems to be a general consensus in ACF that programs that expire
and can be renewed are not Trialware. I think perhaps that should be
"Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time or
number of uses."
"Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time or
number of uses. Programs that can be reactivated without payment are not
considered Trialware."

Good point. As an example, Avast! needs to be renewed once a year,
and I wouldn't call it Trialware, but rather Registerware.

Again, using Avast! as an example, a lot of the clarification is
rightly contained in the Pricelessware Home program descriptions:
"(Liteware) (Registerware: email; name; country) (free for personal
use) The trial version is fully functional for sixty days. You may
register at any time during that period. After one year you must
reregister to obtain a new license key."

IMHO, the Glossary doesn't need to be all-inclusive such that every
program has to be hammered into one and only one category. IOW, I
don't personally see the need to create a "Renewalware" category
subdivided by "Personal Use Only Renewalware." All that should be
included in the program description, not only on the Pricelessware
Home site, but also when ACF members recommend or post information
about a particular software program. Most already do that, and when a
critical item is left out, someone usually follows up with a comment
to spell out any limitation or consideration in more detail.

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Ron May
IMHO, the Glossary doesn't need to be all-inclusive such that every
program has to be hammered into one and only one category.

Agree. The glossary is intended to be a "ready reference" for the most
commonly used ware names - a newbies guide to the wonderful world of
Freeware. We have tried to KISS ;) and I think that's worked out well so
far.

Susan

[Ocean]

Post by Susan Bugher
Ware Glossary - Annual Review

Just a general question here. Do I need permission from anyone to write
a Ware Types list for my own web site? I intend to use footnotes and
quote all my sources, including Pricelessware's Ware Glossary,
Wikipedia, and other sites that provided material for the definitions.
Mine will be more in depth and detailed. Pricelessware's seem to be much
shorter and more concise.

[Klaatu]

Post by Ocean
Just a general question here. Do I need permission from anyone to write
a Ware Types list for my own web site?

If you do you're living in the wrong country...

[Ocean]

Post by Klaatu

Post by Ocean
Just a general question here. Do I need permission from anyone to write
a Ware Types list for my own web site?

If you do you're living in the wrong country...

Well, I do live in a free country, but it is still polite to ask, since
some of the definitions or parts of them may be verbatim (word-for-word)
from Pricelessware's Ware Glossary. I do not want anyone here mad at me.
I'm trying to build a freeware site and forum, and there's still a lot
of work to do. Pricelessware and ACF are my first sources for finding
freeware, and I want to stay on good terms with everyone.

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Ocean

Post by Klaatu

Post by Ocean
Just a general question here. Do I need permission from anyone to write
a Ware Types list for my own web site?

If you do you're living in the wrong country...

Well, I do live in a free country, but it is still polite to ask, since
some of the definitions or parts of them may be verbatim (word-for-word)
from Pricelessware's Ware Glossary. I do not want anyone here mad at me.
I'm trying to build a freeware site and forum, and there's still a lot
of work to do. Pricelessware and ACF are my first sources for finding
freeware, and I want to stay on good terms with everyone.

Borrow away. :)

The "© alt.comp.freeware 1999-2006" notices on ACF's PWH web site are a
bit of insurance against possible *misuse*. Newsgroup participants are
free to mirror the entire site if they like or use bits and pieces of
information with proper attribution as needed.

Susan

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Susan Bugher
Ware Glossary - Annual Review
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php

Speaking of square pegs. . .

Program: Software Virtualization Solution (SVS)
Company: Altiris
http://www.altiris.com/Download/svsPersonal.aspx

a tiny bit of the EULA that's presented. . .

"2. LICENSE GRANT. Provided you comply with all terms and conditions of
this EULA, Altiris grants you a personal, non-exclusive,
non-transferable, revocable and limited license to use the Software
solely for personal, non-commercial use in a license count not to exceed
ten Nodes (hereinafter, “Personal Use” license)." <SNIP>

Note the word "revocable".

"Under this EULA, a “Node” is any asset under management by the
Software. An asset is: (a) a physical device such as a computer, PDA,
or server, (b) a virtual device, such as an operating environment that
may be running concurrently with another operating environment on a
single physical device (e.g., VMware*, Virtual PC*, Virtual Server*), or
(c) an object stored by the Software in a database, such object
representing a physical or virtual asset for which data is being tracked
or managed by the Software (e.g., printer, copier, etc.). A Node will
be deemed consumed once an asset (as defined above) has been managed by
the Software product. An asset has been managed by the Software once
the Software has (i) been run locally on an asset, (ii) remotely
interacted with and/or received a response from an asset, (iii)
configured or changed a setting of or migrated settings to or from an
asset, or (iv) otherwise performed any management functionality that
such particular Software product has been designed to perform with
respect to an asset."

I think that means Liteware. . . ;)

You don't have to register but you DO need a product key. . .

Would anyone like to propose a ware description for this app?

Susan

[Craig]

Susan Bugher wrote:
...

Post by Susan Bugher
Speaking of square pegs. . .
Program: Software Virtualization Solution (SVS)
Company: Altiris
http://www.altiris.com/Download/svsPersonal.aspx
a tiny bit of the EULA that's presented. . .

...

Post by Susan Bugher
You don't have to register but you DO need a product key. . .
Would anyone like to propose a ware description for this app?

cross-eyed-wear %}

-Craig

[B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson]

Post by Susan Bugher
Speaking of square pegs. . .
Program: Software Virtualization Solution (SVS)
Company: Altiris
http://www.altiris.com/Download/svsPersonal.aspx

<Extract of EULA snipped>

Post by Susan Bugher
I think that means Liteware. . . ;)

I agree.

Post by Susan Bugher
You don't have to register but you DO need a product key. . .

Then: "Liteware, Registerware". As it is a general EULA, intended for
all(?) Altiris products, the phrase:

| The use of the Software may require an “activation key”
^^^
doesn't say anything about SVS (Personal). I don't bother to try,
whether it really requires an activation key. Maybe you have?

Post by Susan Bugher
"2. LICENSE GRANT. Provided you comply with all terms and conditions of
this EULA, Altiris grants you a personal, non-exclusive,
non-transferable, revocable and limited license to use the Software
solely for personal, non-commercial use in a license count not to exceed
ten Nodes (hereinafter, “Personal Use” license)." <SNIP>
Note the word "revocable".

I see no harm in this one. The EULA states one (and only one!)
condition, when the license may be revoked:

| The licenses granted herein shall automatically terminate without notice
| if you fail to comply with any material provision of this EULA.

If they added no such wording or a more general one, the risk for
unilateral termination of the license on the part of Altiris would
be higher. The same would be true, if Altiris offered a *service*,
with ongoing need of input by Altiris. Then the wording, too, would
IMHO be sufficient for a general termination at some point.

As it is, any user should (still IMHO) be safe to assume infinite
usage right. Updates, OTOH, are explicitly excluded. So there *may*
be free ones, but not necessarily so.

A final decision could only come from adjudicating that question.
I'd expect different ones from different courts within most
countries. (Let alone the mess to be seen when comparing the
results of jurisdiction between countries...)

In such cases, ongoing personal usage after single-sided termination
by Altiris could scarcely be prosecuted until at one day in future
one court would approve the right of Altiris to revoke the license.
Which I regard unlikely... ;-)

BeAr

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Bear Bottoms

Post by Susan Bugher
Speaking of square pegs. . .
Program: Software Virtualization Solution (SVS)
Company: Altiris
http://www.altiris.com/Download/svsPersonal.aspx
I think that means Liteware. . . ;)

I agree.

Post by Susan Bugher
You don't have to register but you DO need a product key. . .

Then: "Liteware, Registerware". As it is a general EULA, intended for
| The use of the Software may require an “activation key”
^^^
doesn't say anything about SVS (Personal). I don't bother to try,
whether it really requires an activation key. Maybe you have?

Near the top of the page:

"If you accept the terms of the EULA, you will be presented with a zip
file containing your license key and a copy of the EULA. Please keep
this file in a safe place for future reference."

I agreed to the EULA and was presented with a download link. That's as
far as I went => (Registerware (optional): product key (required))

Post by Bear Bottoms

Post by Susan Bugher
"2. LICENSE GRANT. Provided you comply with all terms and conditions of
this EULA, Altiris grants you a personal, non-exclusive,
non-transferable, revocable and limited license to use the Software
solely for personal, non-commercial use in a license count not to exceed
ten Nodes (hereinafter, “Personal Use” license)." <SNIP>
Note the word "revocable".

I see no harm in this one. The EULA states one (and only one!)
| The licenses granted herein shall automatically terminate without notice
| if you fail to comply with any material provision of this EULA.
If they added no such wording or a more general one, the risk for
unilateral termination of the license on the part of Altiris would
be higher. The same would be true, if Altiris offered a *service*,
with ongoing need of input by Altiris. Then the wording, too, would
IMHO be sufficient for a general termination at some point.
As it is, any user should (still IMHO) be safe to assume infinite
usage right. Updates, OTOH, are explicitly excluded. So there *may*
be free ones, but not necessarily so.

I think that's the first time I've seen "revocable" in that section of a
EULA so it kind of lept out at me. . . ISTM revocable *could* be
their way of saying Trialware. . . dunno if that's what they mean or
not. . .

"It's hard to tell the depth of the well from the length of the handle
on the pump." (from an old song) IMO something similar can be said re
programs and EULAs. ;)

Post by Bear Bottoms
A final decision could only come from adjudicating that question.
I'd expect different ones from different courts within most
countries. (Let alone the mess to be seen when comparing the
results of jurisdiction between countries...)
In such cases, ongoing personal usage after single-sided termination
by Altiris could scarcely be prosecuted until at one day in future
one court would approve the right of Altiris to revoke the license.
Which I regard unlikely... ;-)

There are *lots* of fun things to speculate on, aren't there? :)

Susan

[B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson]

On Fri, 15 Sep 2006 12:08:59 -0400, Susan Bugher wrote:

[Altiris SVS EULA]

Post by Susan Bugher
I think that's the first time I've seen "revocable" in that section of a
EULA so it kind of lept out at me. . .

That term has been used by Microsoft with "Volume license" models
and content transferred via MSN for years.

Post by Susan Bugher
ISTM revocable *could* be their way of saying Trialware. . .
dunno if that's what they mean or not. . .

I think, they just did some copy-paste of interestingly sounding
phrases from existing EULA's. If they meant to create some means
for general license withdrawal, they did a poor job, IMHO. (Out
of reasons I mentioned in my last posting.)

Post by Susan Bugher
There are *lots* of fun things to speculate on, aren't there? :)

I wouldn't exactly call them "fun things". But there sure *is*
speculation involved...

BeAr

[Susan Bugher]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
[Altiris SVS EULA]

Post by Susan Bugher
I think that's the first time I've seen "revocable" in that section of a
EULA so it kind of lept out at me. . .

That term has been used by Microsoft with "Volume license" models
and content transferred via MSN for years.

Thank you for adding to my meager store of knowledge (I need ALL the
help I can get and I count on you to furnish some of it). :) :) :)

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson

Post by Susan Bugher
ISTM revocable *could* be their way of saying Trialware. . .
dunno if that's what they mean or not. . .

I think, they just did some copy-paste of interestingly sounding
phrases from existing EULA's. If they meant to create some means
for general license withdrawal, they did a poor job, IMHO. (Out
of reasons I mentioned in my last posting.)

I meant perhaps they've included a "drop dead" mechanism in the file (a
de facto withdrawal rather than a legal one) and this is their way of
saying so. That bit of paranoia may be a result of Serif's failure to
mention one "feature" of their "free forever" apps (the inability to
install them on a new hard drive -> a new product key is required).

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson

Post by Susan Bugher
There are *lots* of fun things to speculate on, aren't there? :)

I wouldn't exactly call them "fun things". But there sure *is*
speculation involved...

Yup.

Susan

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Susan Bugher
Ware Glossary - Annual Review
Please propose additions and revisions that you feel would be useful
(quote *only* the text you wish to revise if you are proposing a
revised definition).
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php

ATM it's hard to read the tea leaves - I'd like a bit more input from
the group. Two or three posts favoring a revision do not indicate a
*consensus* for the revision. If you favor one of the proposed revisions
please say so. If you think the glossary is fine as it is please say that.

Several definitions have been proposed for Bundleware. A proposal that
we define "bundled" or "software bundle" instead (in the section at the
top of the page that defines software) has also been made (since
defining *Bundleware* seems to be a bit tricky).

I've proposed a revision of the Trialware definition:

http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php#Trialware
"Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time or
number of uses."

proposed definition:
"Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time or
number of uses. Programs that can be reactivated without payment are not
considered Trialware."

TIA for posting your opinion in this thread. :)

Susan

[B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson]

On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 11:39:38 -0400, Susan Bugher wrote:

[Ware Glossary - Annual Review]

Post by Susan Bugher
ATM it's hard to read the tea leaves -

I must say, I didn't like the approach possible "consensus [...]
through discussion" from the beginning. The discussion thread
has, at the moment, 70+ postings. It is difficult to know, who
(besides you) still keeps track of all posted opinions. And
I even doubt that all, who want to have a word in the final
decision, still follow this thread.

You mentioned 2 proposed changes (Trialware and Bundleware).
I suggest, you open a new thread which solely *announces* 2 polls
and contains the supposed wording of the polls. MsgID links to the
source postings of the proposals would be nice.

Any suggestions for changes in these polls should go either
to that thread or into the discussion thread. After a couple
of predefined days, both polls go out with their final wording.
Through this intermediate step we might avoid most of the
discussion, which usually pops up inside poll threads. (About
wording, alternatives,...)

Post by Susan Bugher
I'd like a bit more input from the group. Two or three posts favoring a
revision do not indicate a *consensus* for the revision. If you favor
one of the proposed revisions please say so. If you think the glossary
is fine as it is please say that.

I favor a poll for both suggested changes, including all proposed
(and not withdrawn) variants. That would mean a yes/no poll for
Trialware and an alternatives poll for Bundleware, at the moment.

BeAr

[Craig]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
[Ware Glossary - Annual Review]

Post by Susan Bugher
ATM it's hard to read the tea leaves -

...

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
I favor a poll for both suggested changes, including all proposed
(and not withdrawn) variants. That would mean a yes/no poll for
Trialware and an alternatives poll for Bundleware, at the moment.

Yea;

It's the meritorious KISS route. For me, in following this discussion,
I hadn't bothered posting anything because building consensus around
topics of definition seemed like just too much trouble(tm).

To add to BeAr's idea, I'd add a start date and a close date. Say a
week. That should give even the dial-ups from Tazmania enough time...

fwiw,
-Craig

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Craig

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
[Ware Glossary - Annual Review]

Post by Susan Bugher
ATM it's hard to read the tea leaves -

Results 1 - 6 of 6 for group:alt.comp.freeware
insubject:ware insubject:glossary

Ware Glossary - Annual Review
alt.comp.freeware - Sep 22, 70 messages - 15 authors

Post by Craig

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
I favor a poll for both suggested changes, including all proposed (and
not withdrawn) variants. That would mean a yes/no poll for Trialware
and an alternatives poll for Bundleware, at the moment.

<RANT>

POLL? To date only *15* people have *posted* in the thread.

Post by Craig
Yea;
It's the meritorious KISS route. For me, in following this discussion,
I hadn't bothered posting anything because building consensus around
topics of definition seemed like just too much trouble(tm).
To add to BeAr's idea, I'd add a start date and a close date. Say a
week. That should give even the dial-ups from Tazmania enough time...

KISS my. . . ;) You're not simplifying - you're trying to shove the
work on to my shoulders. *I* should leap at the chance to organize a
poll when *you* weren't even willing to post in the thread because it
"seemed like just too much trouble(tm)"?

and. . .

What if we have a poll and nobody comes? like last year. . .

Results 1 - 6 of 6 for group:alt.comp.freeware
insubject:ware insubject:glossary

Ware Glossary - Annual Review
alt.comp.freeware - May 7 2005, 56 messages - 12 authors

Ballot and Opinion Poll: ACF Ware Glossary
alt.comp.freeware - May 11 2005, 30 messages - 15 authors

Any newsgroup participant can start a poll. If you want to have a poll
have at it.

As for me. . . I'll wait for some further signs of interest in the
*topic*.

</RANT>

Susan

[Craig]

Post by Susan Bugher
- you're trying to shove the
work on to my shoulders. *I* should leap at the chance to organize a
poll when *you* weren't even willing to post in the thread because it
"seemed like just too much trouble(tm)"?

... <shrug> What can I say? I'm trying to do you wrong. I've been outed.

Post by Susan Bugher
Any newsgroup participant can start a poll. If you want to have a poll
have at it.

duly noted.

-Craig

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Craig

Post by Susan Bugher
- you're trying to shove the
work on to my shoulders. *I* should leap at the chance to organize a
poll when *you* weren't even willing to post in the thread because it
"seemed like just too much trouble(tm)"?

... <shrug> What can I say? I'm trying to do you wrong. I've been outed.

Sorry - I laid the criticism on rather heavily just so I could work in
the double entendre. . . OTOH. . . it sure didn't look like KISS
from here. . .

Susan

[B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson]

On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 23:16:59 -0400, Susan Bugher wrote:

[Ware Glossary - Annual Review]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
I favor a poll for both suggested changes, including all proposed (and
not withdrawn) variants. That would mean a yes/no poll for Trialware
and an alternatives poll for Bundleware, at the moment.

<RANT>
POLL? To date only *15* people have *posted* in the thread.

Would you like to have dozens "me too" / "never with me" posts in
a discussion thread?? It is already hard to sort out differences
and things in common.

Post by Susan Bugher
you're trying to shove the work on to my shoulders. *I* should leap at
the chance to organize a poll

<Shrug> You started the thing and announced to poll the group if
differences show up. Now, that's just what happened.

I, for instance, only posted before in this thread, because I
thought I could add something (hopefully) useful. I wouldn't
have posted with a simple statement as mentioned above. And (in
fact) didn't do so for Trialware. Although I - of course - have
an opinion on that. It is one of the two choices. And I wait
for a poll to declare which... ;-)

Post by Susan Bugher
What if we have a poll and nobody comes? like last year. . .

Anybody can count the votes in a poll thread. If a variant is
favored by only one opinion (or by one opinion more than the
other choices), that variant will win the poll. Not posting
means either consensus with the current status of the poll
(hoping, it will not change on last account) or plain lack of
interest. In either case, the result of the poll will be valid.
It simply doesn't matter, how many votes are cast.

Post by Susan Bugher
As for me. . . I'll wait for some further signs of interest in the
*topic*.

<Shrug again> You started the... (Ahem.) ;-)

BeAr

[Susan Bugher]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
[Ware Glossary - Annual Review]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
I favor a poll for both suggested changes, including all proposed (and
not withdrawn) variants. That would mean a yes/no poll for Trialware
and an alternatives poll for Bundleware, at the moment.

<RANT>
POLL? To date only *15* people have *posted* in the thread.

Would you like to have dozens "me too" / "never with me" posts in
a discussion thread?? It is already hard to sort out differences
and things in common.

Apologies for the rant. Yes, I'd like to see dozens of "I'm in favor of
that"/ "no - don't revise/add that" posts - IOW informal voting during
the discussion.

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson

Post by Susan Bugher
you're trying to shove the work on to my shoulders. *I* should leap at
the chance to organize a poll

<Shrug> You started the thing and announced to poll the group if
differences show up. Now, that's just what happened.

Yahbut. . . I was thinking of a *division* of opinion in the group -
not a *lack* of opinion.

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
I, for instance, only posted before in this thread, because I
thought I could add something (hopefully) useful. I wouldn't
have posted with a simple statement as mentioned above. And (in
fact) didn't do so for Trialware. Although I - of course - have
an opinion on that. It is one of the two choices. And I wait
for a poll to declare which... ;-)

Post by Susan Bugher
What if we have a poll and nobody comes? like last year. . .

Anybody can count the votes in a poll thread. If a variant is
favored by only one opinion (or by one opinion more than the
other choices), that variant will win the poll. Not posting
means either consensus with the current status of the poll
(hoping, it will not change on last account) or plain lack of
interest. In either case, the result of the poll will be valid.
It simply doesn't matter, how many votes are cast.

Okay. Uncle. . . We will have a poll. Be it on your head. <VBG>

1. A proposed glossary revision should be clearly identified as such to
distinguish it from discussion and examples of definitions. That hasn't
happened consistently this year. I can't tell what proposals are on the
table, which proposals have been withdrawn etc. etc. I need some
clarification -> a post from anyone who wants an addition/revision
placed on the ballot giving the exact wording of the proposed revision
or addition and noting PROPOSED ADDITIOMS and REVISIONS as such - to
distinguish them from comments.

2. I'll set the timetable for the poll in a couple of days (when all
proposed additions/revisions appear to have been posted).

3. If several definitions or revisions are proposed for one "ware" and
the voting does not produce a *majority* for one of the choices a
run-off ballot will be posted to determine the winner.

Susan

[Susan Bugher]

A poll has been requested. It will be posted in a few days. I need to
know the proposed revisions and additions that should be placed on the

Post by Susan Bugher
1. A proposed glossary revision should be clearly identified as such to
distinguish it from discussion and examples of definitions. That hasn't
happened consistently this year. I can't tell what proposals are on the
table, which proposals have been withdrawn etc. etc. I need some
clarification -> a post from anyone who wants an addition/revision
placed on the ballot giving the exact wording of the proposed revision
or addition and noting PROPOSED ADDITIOMS and REVISIONS as such - to
distinguish them from comments.
2. I'll set the timetable for the poll in a couple of days (when all
proposed additions/revisions appear to have been posted).
3. If several definitions or revisions are proposed for one "ware" and
the voting does not produce a *majority* for one of the choices a
run-off ballot will be posted to determine the winner.

Susan

[B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson]

Post by Susan Bugher
A poll has been requested. It will be posted in a few days. I need to
know the proposed revisions and additions that should be placed on the
ballot.

To help Susan I try to sum up the proposals posted (and not withdrawn)
up to now. Corrections and additions are (of course) welcome. Details
can be found following the Msg-Id's.

According to the posts within the Ware Glossary thread, the following
changes will be subject of the poll:

1) Trialware:
a) Keep current definition:
Software which stops working after a period of time or number of uses.
b) Message-ID: <***@individual.net>:
Software which stops working after a period of time or number of uses.
Programs that can be reactivated without payment are not considered
Trialware.

2) Bundleware:
a) No additions to the glossary (including the definition for Software)
necessary.
b) Message-ID: <***@individual.net>:
Define "software bundle" rather than "Bundleware". A "software bundle"
could be defined in the section at the top of the page where we define
"software".
c) Message-ID: <oGHNg.1161$***@newssvr27.news.prodigy.net>:
Software that often contains bundled Adware or Spyware. BundleWare
provides a means to help distribute adware or spyware via a bundled
software package. The adware or spyware may be part of the main program
or may be a separate program added to the Setup installer that functions
independently of the main program. In some cases the main program will
not function if the adware is removed, or will not install unless the
adware is installed. Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation"
or "opt out" capability, so the user can choose not to install the
unwanted extras by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the
installation prompts. Unsafe Bundleware does not provide this choice
and after infecting your computer, continues to download other viruses,
worms, trojans, and other parasites onto your computer, without your
knowledge or consent.
d) Message-ID: <***@individual.net>:
Additional applications (usually undesired) are included in the
delivery of the program or collection of programs).
e) Message-ID: <***@br.ederson.news.arcor.de>:
Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often unsolicited)
separable software.

Opinions on changes to the upcoming polls (esp. new suggestions) should
be posted *before* the poll actually starts. It is not possible to
change the conditions halfway through a vote. Only chance would be to
stop and start anew. Which we should avoid, shouldn't we? ;-)

BeAr

[Susan Bugher]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson

Post by Susan Bugher
A poll has been requested. It will be posted in a few days. I need to
know the proposed revisions and additions that should be placed on the
ballot.

To help Susan I try to sum up the proposals posted (and not withdrawn)
up to now. Corrections and additions are (of course) welcome. Details
can be found following the Msg-Id's.

Thank you BeAr. :) :) :)

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
According to the posts within the Ware Glossary thread, the following
Software which stops working after a period of time or number of uses.
Software which stops working after a period of time or number of uses.
Programs that can be reactivated without payment are not considered
Trialware.
a) No additions to the glossary (including the definition for Software)
necessary.
Define "software bundle" rather than "Bundleware". A "software bundle"
could be defined in the section at the top of the page where we define
"software".

Let me turn that into a proposed revision.

http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php

<q>
Software: the instructions executed by a computer.

In theory software does not include the data processed by the
instructions. In practice a combination of instructions and data is
often called software.
</q>

I propose an additional paragraph:

Software applications may be delivered in a collection, a package or a
bundle. Software collections and software packages have a unifying theme
or purpose. A software bundle contains unrelated applications.

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
Software that often contains bundled Adware or Spyware. BundleWare
provides a means to help distribute adware or spyware via a bundled
software package. The adware or spyware may be part of the main program
or may be a separate program added to the Setup installer that functions
independently of the main program. In some cases the main program will
not function if the adware is removed, or will not install unless the
adware is installed. Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation"
or "opt out" capability, so the user can choose not to install the
unwanted extras by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the
installation prompts. Unsafe Bundleware does not provide this choice
and after infecting your computer, continues to download other viruses,
worms, trojans, and other parasites onto your computer, without your
knowledge or consent.
Additional applications (usually undesired) are included in the
delivery of the program or collection of programs).

I withdraw the above proposal d).

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson
Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often unsolicited)
separable software.
Opinions on changes to the upcoming polls (esp. new suggestions) should
be posted *before* the poll actually starts. It is not possible to
change the conditions halfway through a vote. Only chance would be to
stop and start anew. Which we should avoid, shouldn't we? ;-)

Yes indeed. :) Ocean made some posts about other ware types. I don't
know if she wants anything from those posts placed on the upcoming
ballot. I'm watching for a post from her - I think we'll be good to go
after that. . .

Susan

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson

Post by Susan Bugher
A poll has been requested. It will be posted in a few days. I need to
know the proposed revisions and additions that should be placed on
the ballot.

Opinions on changes to the upcoming polls (esp. new suggestions) should
be posted *before* the poll actually starts. It is not possible to
change the conditions halfway through a vote. Only chance would be to
stop and start anew. Which we should avoid, shouldn't we? ;-)

Yes indeed. :) Ocean made some posts about other ware types. I don't
know if she wants anything from those posts placed on the upcoming
ballot. I'm watching for a post from her - I think we'll be good to go
after that. . .

Speaking of not making changes after the voting starts (and past snafus)
;) I'd like to make sure the wording is clear before I post the ballot.
Below is a draft of the ballot choices. Comments and suggested revisions
please.

Susan

-------------------

Trialware

Keep the current definition:
Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time or number
of uses.

Revise the definition as follows:
Trialware: Software which stops working after a period of time or number
of uses. Programs that can be reactivated without payment are not
considered Trialware.

---------------

Software

Keep the current definition (no additions):
Software: the instructions executed by a computer.
In theory software does not include the data processed by the
instructions. In practice a combination of instructions and data is
often called software.

Add the following paragraph:
Software applications are sometimes delivered in collections, packages
or bundles. Software collections and packages have a unifying theme or
purpose. A software bundle contains unrelated applications.

---------------

Bundleware

Do not add a description for Bundleware

Add the following definition:
Bundleware: Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often
unsolicited) separable software.

Add the following definition:
Bundleware: Software that often contains bundled Adware or Spyware.
BundleWare provides a means to help distribute adware or spyware via a
bundled software package. The adware or spyware may be part of the main
program or may be a separate program added to the Setup installer that
functions independently of the main program. In some cases the main
program will not function if the adware is removed, or will not install
unless the adware is installed. Safe Bundleware provides "optional
installation" or "opt out" capability, so the user can choose not to
install the unwanted extras by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons
during the installation prompts. Unsafe Bundleware does not provide this
choice and after infecting your computer, continues to download other
viruses, worms, trojans, and other parasites onto your computer, without
your knowledge or consent.

----------------

[Steven Burn]

Post by Susan Bugher
Trialware
Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time or number
of uses.

This is more accurate IMHO

Post by Susan Bugher
Software
Software applications are sometimes delivered in collections, packages
or bundles. Software collections and packages have a unifying theme or
purpose. A software bundle contains unrelated applications.

If bundleware is to become a category of it's own (which IMHO, it should),
then this is not needed.

Post by Susan Bugher
Bundleware
Do not add a description for Bundleware
Bundleware: Software that often contains bundled Adware or Spyware.
BundleWare provides a means to help distribute adware or spyware via a
bundled software package. The adware or spyware may be part of the main
program or may be a separate program added to the Setup installer that
functions independently of the main program. In some cases the main
program will not function if the adware is removed, or will not install
unless the adware is installed. Safe Bundleware provides "optional
installation" or "opt out" capability, so the user can choose not to
install the unwanted extras by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons
during the installation prompts. Unsafe Bundleware does not provide this
choice and after infecting your computer, continues to download other
viruses, worms, trojans, and other parasites onto your computer, without
your knowledge or consent.

Definately this one.

[Ocean]

PROPOSED REVISION - Software

Software: the instructions executed by a computer.

In theory software does not include the data processed by the
instructions. In practice a combination of instructions and data is
often called software. Software applications are sometimes delivered in
collections, packages or bundles. Software collections and packages have
a unifying theme or purpose. A software bundle contains unrelated
applications.

PROPOSED ADDITION - Bundleware #1

Bundleware: Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often
unsolicited) separable software.

PROPOSED ADDITION - Bundleware #2

Bundleware: Additional applications (usually undesired) are included in
the delivery of the program or collection of programs).

PROPOSED ADDITION - Bundleware #3

Bundleware: Software that often contains bundled Adware or Spyware.
BundleWare provides a means to help distribute adware or spyware via a
bundled software package. The adware or spyware may be part of the main
program or may be a separate program added to the Setup installer that
functions independently of the main program. In some cases the main
program will not function if the adware is removed, or will not install
unless the adware is installed.

- Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or "opt out"
capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted extras by
checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation prompts.
- Unsafe Bundleware does not provide this choice and after infecting
your computer, continues to download other viruses, worms, trojans, and
other parasites onto your computer, without your knowledge or consent.

PROPOSED ADDITION - Bundleware #4

(same as #3 except for this)

- Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or "opt out"
capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted extras by
checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation prompts.
Or, the "optional components" can be disabled/removed after installation
by settings, preferences, Add/Remove Programs, or other means.

(or with parentheses)

- Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or "opt out"
capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted extras
(by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation
prompts). Or, the "optional components" can be disabled/removed after
installation (by settings, preferences, Add/Remove Programs, or other
means).

PROPOSED ADDITION - Bundleware #5

(same as #3 except removing the reference to disabling or removing
things after installation)

- Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or "opt out"
capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted extras by
checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation prompts.

(or with parentheses)

- Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or "opt out"
capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted extras
(by checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation prompts).

PROPOSED REVISION - Trialware #1

Trialware: Software which stops working after a period of time or number
of uses. Programs that can be reactivated without payment are not
considered Trialware.

PROPOSED REVISION - Trialware #2

Trialware: Software that you can test, evaluate, and "try before you
buy". The software stops working completely or turns into a limited free
version (freeware, liteware or crippleware) after a period of time or
number of uses. To enable all features and remove restrictions after the
trial period is over, you must purchase (register, unlock, and/or
activate) the program.

PROPOSED REVISION - Demoware

Demoware: Software that is intended to give potential purchasers an idea
of how the program works. It is a more restrictive form of trialware, so
you may not be able to test or evaluate all features. Not a full
version, type of limitation varies.

PROPOSED REVISION - Expireware

Expireware: Software with a built-in expiration date or time, which
stops working on a specific calendar date or after a certain number of
days, minutes or uses. Unlike some forms of shareware and trialware,
expireware cannot be used at all after the expiration date.

PROPOSED REVISION - Shareware

Shareware: commercial software that can be downloaded, often for free.
Payment is required for legal use of the software beyond the trial
period. Some authors use the honor system (unrestricted shareware); more
commonly, code is included to prevent the use of some or all functions
(trialware/expireware) if payment is not made in accordance with the
shareware agreement.



That's the best I can do right now. I'm in the middle of a new clean
install of Windows and getting all my programs reinstalled, activated,
configured and secured. Sorry, but there's no time to do more research.
Maybe someone can get the Message-IDs for me. I look forward to
participating in the voting process.

[Susan Bugher]

Ocean wrote:

Ocean, please propose only *ONE* new or revised definition for each
"ware type" - the one that you think we should adopt.

Susan

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Susan Bugher
Ocean, please propose only *ONE* new or revised definition for each
"ware type" - the one that you think we should adopt.

and. . .

Please do NOT propose a definition that has already been proposed by
someone else.

TIA :)

Susan

[Susan Bugher]

Things are getting confused again. . .

Below are the proposed revisions and additions that are "on the table"
now AFAICT. If you wish to add to the list please insert your proposed
revision in the proper place *with* your name. Propose only *ONE* new or
revised definition for each "ware type". (If you are in *general*
agreement with a proposed ware description ask the OP if sHe is willing
to revise the wording *before* posting an alternate definition.)

TIA

Susan

------------------------------------------------------

Posted for review and comments.


********** THIS IS NOT A BALLOT *************


Listed in order of appearance on the web page (proposed NEW ware
definitions are listed at the end):
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php

Software
(vote for no more than one)

Keep the current description:
Software: the instructions executed by a computer.
In theory software does not include the data processed by the
instructions. In practice a combination of instructions and data is
often called software.

(Susan Bugher)
Add the following paragraph:
Software applications are sometimes delivered in collections, packages
or bundles. Software collections and packages have a unifying theme or
purpose. A software bundle contains unrelated applications.

---------------

Demoware
(vote for no more than one)

Keep the current definition:
Demoware: software that is intended to give potential purchasers an idea
of how the program works. Not a full version, type of limitation varies.

(Ocean)
Revise the definition as follows:
Demoware: Software that is intended to give potential purchasers an idea
of how the program works. It is a more restrictive form of trialware, so
you may not be able to test or evaluate all features. Not a full
version, type of limitation varies.

---------------

Shareware
(vote for no more than one)

Keep the current definition:
Shareware: commercial software that can be downloaded. Payment is
required for legal use of the software. Some authors use the honor
system, more commonly code is included to prevent the use of some or all
functions if payment is not made in accordance with the shareware
agreement.

(Ocean)
Revise the definition as follows:
Shareware: commercial software that can be downloaded, often for free.
Payment is required for legal use of the software beyond the trial
period. Some authors use the honor system (unrestricted shareware); more
commonly, code is included to prevent the use of some or all functions
(trialware/expireware) if payment is not made in accordance with the
shareware agreement.

---------------

Trialware
(vote for no more than one)

Keep the current definition:
Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time or number
of uses.

(Susan Bugher)
Revise the definition as follows:
Trialware: Software which stops working after a period of time or number
of uses. Programs that can be reactivated without payment are not
considered Trialware.

(Ocean)
Trialware: Software that you can test, evaluate, and "try before you
buy". The software stops working completely or turns into a limited free
version (freeware, liteware or crippleware) after a period of time or
number of uses. To enable all features and remove restrictions after the
trial period is over, you must purchase (register, unlock, and/or
activate) the program.

---------------

NEW
Bundleware
(vote for no more than one)

Do not add a definition.

(B. R. 'BeAr' Ederso)
Add the following definition:
Bundleware: Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often
unsolicited) separable software.

----------------

NEW
Expireware
(vote for no more than one)

Do not add a definition.

(Ocean)
Add the following definition:
Expireware: Software with a built-in expiration date or time, which
stops working on a specific calendar date or after a certain number of
days, minutes or uses. Unlike some forms of shareware and trialware,
expireware cannot be used at all after the expiration date.


***********************

[Ocean]

Post by Susan Bugher
Things are getting confused again. . .
Below are the proposed revisions and additions that are "on the table"
now AFAICT. If you wish to add to the list please insert your proposed
revision in the proper place *with* your name. Propose only *ONE* new or
revised definition for each "ware type". (If you are in *general*
agreement with a proposed ware description ask the OP if sHe is willing
to revise the wording *before* posting an alternate definition.)
TIA
Susan
------------------------------------------------------
Posted for review and comments.
********** THIS IS NOT A BALLOT *************
Listed in order of appearance on the web page (proposed NEW ware
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/acf/WareGlossary.php
Software
(vote for no more than one)
Software: the instructions executed by a computer.
In theory software does not include the data processed by the
instructions. In practice a combination of instructions and data is
often called software.
(Susan Bugher)
Software applications are sometimes delivered in collections, packages
or bundles. Software collections and packages have a unifying theme or
purpose. A software bundle contains unrelated applications.
---------------
Demoware
(vote for no more than one)
Demoware: software that is intended to give potential purchasers an idea
of how the program works. Not a full version, type of limitation varies.
(Ocean)
Demoware: Software that is intended to give potential purchasers an idea
of how the program works. It is a more restrictive form of trialware, so
you may not be able to test or evaluate all features. Not a full
version, type of limitation varies.
---------------
Shareware
(vote for no more than one)
Shareware: commercial software that can be downloaded. Payment is
required for legal use of the software. Some authors use the honor
system, more commonly code is included to prevent the use of some or all
functions if payment is not made in accordance with the shareware agreement.
(Ocean)
Shareware: commercial software that can be downloaded, often for free.
Payment is required for legal use of the software beyond the trial
period. Some authors use the honor system (unrestricted shareware); more
commonly, code is included to prevent the use of some or all functions
(trialware/expireware) if payment is not made in accordance with the
shareware agreement.
---------------
Trialware
(vote for no more than one)
Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time or number
of uses.
(Susan Bugher)
Trialware: Software which stops working after a period of time or number
of uses. Programs that can be reactivated without payment are not
considered Trialware.
(Ocean)
Trialware: Software that you can test, evaluate, and "try before you
buy". The software stops working completely or turns into a limited free
version (freeware, liteware or crippleware) after a period of time or
number of uses. To enable all features and remove restrictions after the
trial period is over, you must purchase (register, unlock, and/or
activate) the program.
---------------
NEW
Bundleware
(vote for no more than one)
Do not add a definition.
(B. R. 'BeAr' Ederso)
Bundleware: Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often
unsolicited) separable software.

(Ocean)
**The first phrase in this definition was adapted from B.R. 'BeAr'
Ederso. The rest is from Ocean.**
Add the following definition:
Bundleware: Software accompanied by substantially distinct (often
unsolicited) software as a separate component. Bundleware provides a
means to help distribute software, often adware or spyware, via a
bundled software package. The adware or spyware may be part of the main
program or may be a separate program added to the Setup installer that
functions independently of the main program. In some cases the main
program will not function if the adware is removed, or will not install
unless the adware is installed.

- Safe Bundleware provides "optional installation" or "opt out"
capability, so the user can choose not to install the unwanted extras by
checking or unchecking boxes/buttons during the installation prompts.
- Unsafe Bundleware does not provide this choice and after infecting
your computer, continues to download other viruses, worms, trojans, and
other parasites onto your computer, without your knowledge or consent.

(Note: I edited my previous definition to include BeAr's. His is
shorter. Mine is longer and more specific. I am going to put this
definition on my web site when my computer upgrades are finished, a few
more days to a week when there's time. Thank you, BeAr. You brought up
some interesting points.)

Post by Susan Bugher
----------------
NEW
Expireware
(vote for no more than one)
Do not add a definition.
(Ocean)
Expireware: Software with a built-in expiration date or time, which
stops working on a specific calendar date or after a certain number of
days, minutes or uses. Unlike some forms of shareware and trialware,
expireware cannot be used at all after the expiration date.
***********************

[Ocean]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Susan Bugher
Ocean, please propose only *ONE* new or revised definition for each
"ware type" - the one that you think we should adopt.

and. . .
Please do NOT propose a definition that has already been proposed by
someone else.
TIA :)
Susan

Apologies. Not intending to copy anyone else's work. Just wanted to list
the ones proposed so far, kind of like you did.

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Ocean

Post by Susan Bugher
Please do NOT propose a definition that has already been proposed by
someone else.

Apologies. Not intending to copy anyone else's work.

That thought never crossed my mind. . .

Just wanted to list

Post by Ocean
the ones proposed so far, kind of like you did.

Yahbut you don't have to track the proposals - for my sins I do. ;) It
was hard for me to tell what *you* were proposing since everything in
your post "looked" new. Anyway - as you saw - I decided adding the name
of the proposer would help me keep things straight.

Susan

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Steven Burn

Post by Susan Bugher
Trialware
Trialware: software which stops working after a period of time or number
of uses.

This is more accurate IMHO

*Accuracy* depends on WHAT apps you want to include in the ware definition.

Is a software app that has to have its registration renewed every year
Trialware? Is an app that expires Trialware if you can "renew" it
(download a fresh copy or updated version and continue to use the app
for free)?

The revision I proposed (Programs that can be reactivated without
payment are not considered Trialware.) would exclude the above apps from
the definition of Trialware. The current definition does not
*specifically* exclude them - I'd like to clarify that gray area (one
way or the other).

Post by Steven Burn

Post by Susan Bugher
Software
Software applications are sometimes delivered in collections, packages
or bundles. Software collections and packages have a unifying theme or
purpose. A software bundle contains unrelated applications.

If bundleware is to become a category of it's own (which IMHO, it should),
then this is not needed.

The proposed Bundleware descriptions do not mention packages or
collections. . .

Susan

[Steven Burn]

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Steven Burn
This is more accurate IMHO

*Accuracy* depends on WHAT apps you want to include in the ware definition.
Is a software app that has to have its registration renewed every year
Trialware? Is an app that expires Trialware if you can "renew" it
(download a fresh copy or updated version and continue to use the app
for free)?
The revision I proposed (Programs that can be reactivated without
payment are not considered Trialware.) would exclude the above apps from
the definition of Trialware. The current definition does not
*specifically* exclude them - I'd like to clarify that gray area (one
way or the other).

Trialware is trialware. If a program expires, it's still trialware, whether
it requires renewal by monetary or other means (e.g. registrationware that
requires periodic re-registration is IMHO, trialware).

Post by Susan Bugher

Post by Steven Burn

Post by Susan Bugher
Software
Software applications are sometimes delivered in collections, packages
or bundles. Software collections and packages have a unifying theme or
purpose. A software bundle contains unrelated applications.

If bundleware is to become a category of it's own (which IMHO, it should),
then this is not needed.

The proposed Bundleware descriptions do not mention packages or
collections. . .

Thats why I voted for including the bundleware description as a category of
it's own ;o)

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Steven Burn
Trialware is trialware. If a program expires, it's still trialware, whether
it requires renewal by monetary or other means (e.g. registrationware that
requires periodic re-registration is IMHO, trialware).

The current Trialware definition is interpreted differently by some ACF
participants - that's been discussed many times (I have the scars to
prove it). ;)

FYI ATM programs that can be renewed are NOT being labeled as Trialware
on the ACF and PL pages.

IMO we need additional language to *clarify* the definition: EITHER
"Programs that can be reactivated without payment are Trialware." OR
"Programs that can be reactivated without payment are NOT Trialware."

Would you like to propose the addition of "Programs that can be
reactivated without payment are Trialware." or something similar.

Susan

[B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson]

Post by Susan Bugher
Okay. Uncle. . . We will have a poll. Be it on your head. <VBG>

I prepare to run into hiding. - Just in case... ;-)

Thank you!
BeAr

[Craig]

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson

Post by Susan Bugher
Okay. Uncle. . . We will have a poll. Be it on your head. <VBG>

I prepare to run into hiding. - Just in case... ;-)
Thank you!
BeAr

Got room in that thar cave?

Thanks Susan!

-Craig

[Susan Bugher]

Post by Craig

Post by B. R. 'BeAr' Ederson

Post by Susan Bugher
Okay. Uncle. . . We will have a poll. Be it on your head. <VBG>

I prepare to run into hiding. - Just in case... ;-)

Got room in that thar cave?

I'm *hoping* it will be a great success (lots of votes etc.) If is you
two should be prepared to take a bow. There has GOT to be SOME good way
to review the glossary. . . maybe this is it.

Susan