Tutorial creating & using Hirens Boot CD & MemTest86 diagnostic stress testing tools for USB boot to Windows 10 PE & WinXPmini on BIOS & UEFI

[Arlen Holder]

Tutorial creating & using Hirens Boot CD & MemTest86 diagnostic stress
testing tools for USB boot to Windows 10 PE & WinXPmini on BIOS & UEFI
(As always, please improve so that all benefit from every action you take.)

Thanks to Mike Easter for suggesting Hiram BootCD USB diagnostic tools.
o What hardware diagnostic stress-testing freeware can you recommend?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.freeware/dkkdOmL95d8>

End result:
a. A 2GB USB stick can boot with BIOS/UEFI to Win10PE for diagnostics
a. A 2GB USB stick can boot with BIOS to WinXPMini for hardware diagnostics

I needed to debug hardware issues on an old 2009 desktop as described here:
o What PC hardware diagnostic stress-testing freeware can you recommend?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.freeware/dkkdOmL95d8>

Win+R > perfmon /rel
<Loading Image...>

This step-by-step tutorial resulted, written so that others always benefit.
(Please test & improve as this is the first pass of this nascent tutorial.)

1. Find an empty USB flash drive of at least 2GB size:
o Hirens BootCD Win10PE used about 1.25 GB of my 1.90 GB flash stick.
<Loading Image...>
o Hirens BootCD 15.2 used about 0.58 GB of my 1.90 GB flash stick.
<Loading Image...>

2. Determine whether your PC is BIOS or UEFI (mine is BIOS).

Win+R > %comspec% /k findstr Callback_BootEnvironmentDetect %SystemRoot%\Panther\setupact.log
o %SystemRoot%\Panther\setupact.log
- Callback_BootEnvironmentDetect: Detected boot environment: BIOS
- Callback_BootEnvironmentDetect: Detected boot environment: UEFI
Note: Mine reported BIOS

Win+R > msinfo32 > System Summary > BIOS Mode
- Win+R > msinfo32 > System Summary > BIOS Mode > Legacy
- Win+R > msinfo32 > System Summary > BIOS Mode > UEFI
Note: Legacy === BIOS

3. If needed, set your PC boot order so that it boots from the USB stick.
For me the defaults worked: i.e., at POST, F10==BIOS, ESC=BOOT, F9=DIAG
Entering Setup > Boot > Boot Device Priority
1st Boot Device = [CD-ROM Group]
2nd Boot Device = [Floppy Group]
3rd Boot Device = [HDD Group]
4th Boot Device = [Network Boot Group]
Note: USB isn't mentioned in my BIOS; but USB booted fine nonetheless.

4. Download the Hiren's Boot CD software containing diagnostic tools:
<http://www.hirensbootcd.org/download/>

a. UEFI/BIOS Win10PE:
Download either the Win10PE BIOS/UEFI HirensBootCD (HBCD) ISO file:
<https://www.hirensbootcd.org/files/HBCD_PE_x64.iso>
<https://www.hirensbootcd.org/files/HBCD_PE_x64.iso>
<http://mirror.sfo12.us.leaseweb.net/hirensbootcd/HBCD_PE_x64.iso>
Name: HBCD_PE_x64.iso
Size: 1354811392 bytes (1292 MiB)
SHA256: D67BCF0437A1BD27F31655C4A9C81C93269A5A239D43F38D0375618443D372BC

b. BIOS WinXPmini:
Or download the BIOS-only WinXPmini HirensBootCD (HBCD) ISO file:
<http://www.hirensbootcd.org/files/Hirens.BootCD.15.2.zip>
Name: Hiren's.BootCD.15.2.iso
Size: 603979776 bytes (576 MiB)
SHA256: 50384A61D304E06B720F9EF729C662D2E9EDA05A96E1C9056975C40E3BF3F2D0

Note: The tools on these two releases are both the same & different:
<Loading Image...>

5. Download the Windows Rufus ISO-to-USB tool:
<https://rufus.ie/>
<https://github.com/pbatard/rufus/releases/download/v3.11/rufus-3.11.exe>
Name: rufus-3.11.exe
Size: 1155640 bytes (1128 KiB)
SHA256: A43BF34285D393F843B05D80F74C4790ED7F6AC636393CA5F6375AE0BB02E719

6. Remove all USB drives & insert the empty USB flash drive into the PC.

7. In Windows, right click on the Rufus executable to run as administrator.

NOTE: The specific settings for creating a BIOS Win10PE USB are not
documented anywhere on the net I could find, so please take note:
<Loading Image...>

a. UEFI Win10PE
To create a bootable USB stick for HBCD_PE_x64.iso on UEFI machines:
When you start Rufus as an admin, accept the Win10 UAC consent prompt.
This brings up the Rufus 3.11.1678 GUI
Set the options to:
- Device: (choose your empty USB stick drive letter and label)
(If you only have one USB stick plugged in, it will default to it.)
- Boot selection:
(Choices are: "Disk or ISO image", "FreeDOS", "Non bootable")
I left the Boot selection at "Disk or ISO image".
I pressed the [SELECT] button to choose the "HBCD_PE_x64.iso" file.
- Partition scheme: GPT (The only options are "GPT" and "MBR")
Target System: The only option is "UEFI (non CSM)"
Volume label: This defaulted to "HBCD_PE_x64"
File system: FAT32 (other choices are "NTFS" & "FAT")
Cluster size: It defaulted to 4096 bytes (but other options existed).
When the Status says "READY", press the "START" button.
A warning pops up saying all data on the USB drive will be destroyed.
Press [OK].
The messages will be:
- Deleting partitions (This may take a while)...
- Partitioning (GPT)...
- Formatting (FAT32)...
- Creating file system: Task 1/5 completed.
- Creating file system: Task 2/5 completed.
- Creating file system: Task 3/5 completed.
- Creating file system: Task 4/5 completed.
- Creating file system: Task 5/5 completed.
- Writing Master Boot Record
- Copying ISO files:
- Success
(Mine took six minutes to complete from start to finish.)

Note: You'll get this error if you create a UEFI USB but boot on BIOS:
<https://i.postimg.cc/2ykDXjW6/hiren01.jpg>
ERROR: BIOS/LEGACY BOOT OF UEFI-ONLY MEDIA
Recreate the drive in RUFUS and use:
* Partition scheme -> MBR
* Target system -> BIOS

b. BIOS Win10PE
To create a bootable USB stick for HBCD_PE_x64.iso on BIOS machines:
* Partition scheme -> MBR
* Target system -> BIOS (it was the only option once MBR was set)
* File system -> NTFS (it was the only option once MBR was set)
(Mine took five minutes to complete from start to finish.)

c. BIOS WinXPmini
To create a bootable USB stick for HBCD 15.2 on BIOS machines:
Boot selection -> Hiren's.BootCD.15.2.iso
Partition scheme -> "MBR" (it's the only option)
Target system -> "BIOS (or UEFI-CSM)" (it's the only option)
Volume label -> HBCD 15.2 (it's the default)
File system -> "FAT32" (other options are "FAT" & "NTFS")
Cluster size -> "4096 bytes (Default)"
[START] (Mine took 30 minutes to complete from start to finish.)

8. Now you can boot using that USB image on BIOS/UEFI for Win10/WinXP!
Note: In my case, I press "ESC" during POST to get to the boot menu.

Win10PE: <https://i.postimg.cc/HsGPFQSZ/hiren02.jpg>
WinXPMini: <https://i.postimg.cc/50BSJCK9/hiren07.jpg>

Note: My boot to Windows10PE was _much_ faster than to WinXPmini.

Win10PE looks just like "regular" Windows 10, kind of sort of:
<https://i.postimg.cc/HsGPFQSZ/hiren02.jpg>

Win10PE had access to the old system also so I could save a screenshot:
<Loading Image...>

9. Each boot environment has similar (but sometimes different) debug tools:
<https://i.postimg.cc/qv5N2sWS/hiren15.jpg>

For example, on the Win10PE, these were the top level tools provided:
<Loading Image...>
o Accessories
o BCD-MBR Tools
o Computer Management
o Driver Management
o Hard Disk Tools
o Network
o Other Tools
o Removable Drive Tools
o Security
o System Tools
o Windows Recovery

Here's what the Hiren PE had in the "Hard Disk Tools" directory:
<Loading Image...>
o Data Recovery
o Defrag
o Diagnostic
o Disk Explorer
o Imaging
o Partition Tools
o Security

Here's what the PE had in the Hard Disk Tools "Diagnostic" category:
<Loading Image...>
o GSmartControl
o HDDScan
o HDTune
o WD Data Lifeguard Diagnostics

For example, here are screenshots of those HDD diagnostics on Win10PE:
<https://i.postimg.cc/CK6c7DB4/hiren06.jpg>
o GSmartControl <Loading Image...>
o HDTune <Loading Image...>
o WD Data Lifeguard Diagnostics <Loading Image...>

Here are HDD diagnostic utilities on WinXPmini (Hirens 15.2 Boot CD):
<Loading Image...>
o Check Disk (chkdsk /f /x)
o CrystalDiskInfo (HDD/SSD SMART info)
o DiskView
o DiskWIpe (by Roadkill)
o HDD Capacity Restore
o HDD Low Level Format Tool
o HDD Scan (Low-level diagnostic)
o HDD Scan (Old version)
o HDD Tune (Test / Health / ErrorScan)
o Victoria (HDD Info / Test)
o Western Digital Data Lifeguard Diagnostic
o HDDScan
o HDTune
o WD Data Lifeguard Diagnostics

Note: While MemTest86 is on the Hirams Boot CD, you can boot it separately:
o UEFI MemTest86 v8
<https://www.memtest86.com/downloads/memtest86-usb.zip>
o BIOS MemTest86 v4
<https://www.memtest86.com/downloads/memtest86-4.3.7-usb.img.zip>
That MemTest86 utility came with an "ImageUSB.exe" utility from
"Passmark.com" <http://www.passmark.com> which seems to do pretty
much whatever Rufus 3.11 did for the Hiren's Boot CD ISO
files to create a bootable USB stick.

See also:
o Windows 10 BSOD indicates a hardware problem - but what hardware is the problem?
<http://www.pcbanter.net/showthread.php?t=1110105>
<https://alt.comp.os.windows-10.narkive.com/oL7PTNKu/windows-10-bsod-indicates-a-hardware-problem-but-what-hardware-is-the-problem>

[Arlen Holder]

Nice tutorial and now that you are loaded for bear and have all the tools -
did any of them provide a clue as to what is causing the BSOD's?

Well, to be frank, I've shot my wad on these classic bear-hunting rifles...
o F9 Build-in HP Diagnostic check === good
o Memtest86v4 RAM Memory check === good
o WD Diagnostic HDD check === good
o Windows Driver Verifier Manager check === good
o USB Host Controller check === good
o MalwareBytes check === good

Given that the Sieber USBTreeView Paul suggested indicated a bad mouse:
o <Loading Image...>
I recently replaced the mouse but there still was one BSOD afterward.

Yet, the BSODs kept coming & seem "maybe" related to "Windows Update"
(although I'm not sure how to interpret this "Hardware Error" output)
o Win+R > perfmon /rel
<Loading Image...>
o [Control Panel\System & Security\Security & Maintenance\Reliability Monitor]
<https://i.postimg.cc/q7ZQbgXy/bsod-bios05.jpg>

Sometimes, the POST never makes it to the checking-USB drives line
(which is a line missing from this screenshot just before the last line)
o <Loading Image...>

But most of the time it boots fine past that penultimate line:
o <Loading Image...>

The Memtest86v4 passes the 16GB of RAM no matter how long I run it:
o <Loading Image...>

BTW, the Windows Driver Verifier Manager checks are enabled by:
o Win+R > verifier
<Loading Image...>
Configure that Windows Driver Verifier Manager
o Create standard settings > Next
o Automatically select all drivers installed on this computer > Finish
o Win+R > shutdown.exe /r /f /t 5 /c "Reboot in 5 seconds!"

I ran the driver verifier for an entire day while using the computer.
o The CPU took a huge hit; but every driver loaded tested out OK.

At Mike Easter's request, I booted to live Knoppix to describe hardware:
<Loading Image...>
o inxi -Fx

For example inxi delineates mobo, graphics, audio, network, partitions:
<Loading Image...
I should note I disabled the Nvidia GeForce 210 card in the BIOS:
<Loading Image...

That "seems" to have helped, but a lot of things "seemed" to have
helped for a while, as just removing & replacing everything inside
that could be removed/replaced seems to have helped at times.

Luckily, I'm not out of .45-70 Government bear-hunting ammo just yet...
where I'm dutifully following this "BSOD Analysis" tutorial:

o Windows BSOD analysis - A thorough usage guide
<https://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/windows-bsod.html>

Which eventually pointed me to these freeware minidump-parsing tools:
o WhoCrashed
<https://www.resplendence.com/downloads>
<https://www.resplendence.com/download/whocrashedSetup.exe>
Name: whocrashedSetup.exe
Size: 9936128 bytes (9703 KiB)
SHA256: 0A7E3A03256D3143118BE5389F0C5F7F405A40066D999E246C57280E9282AE14

o WhySoSlow
<https://www.resplendence.com/downloads>
<https://www.resplendence.com/download/WhySoSlowSetup.exe>
Name: WhySoSlowSetup.exe
Size: 3028336 bytes (2957 KiB)
SHA256: B86CED75CFB352A464613DE922FA8B9D63FA4494EAA24509713C01B0615097B3

o BlueScreenView
<http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/blue_screen_view.html>
<http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/bluescreenview-x64.zip>
Name: BlueScreenView.exe
Size: 146528 bytes (143 KiB)
SHA256: 09F3023554BE864F31D80F2E7E7C7E824D79A69DDF84F1F02A433E85E866282C

o AppCrashView
<http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/app_crash_view.html>
<http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/appcrashview.zip>
Name: AppCrashView.exe
Size: 51408 bytes (50 KiB)
SHA256: A192607D63FFD9448CCAAEAB461D3E3FABFAB999B0FC14CD869CC8C501312839

o WhatIsHang
<http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/what_is_hang.html>
<http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/whatishang-x64.zip>
Name: WhatIsHang.exe
Size: 130144 bytes (127 KiB)
SHA256: E2095DBE5FF7A1E7113ABDF8D26BD8532789CE5B725FBF5321225E743B8E29B0

o WinCrashReport
<http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/application_crash_report.html>
<http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/wincrashreport-x64.zip>
Name: WinCrashReport.exe
Size: 294096 bytes (287 KiB)
SHA256: 6638857A3BF187626B5E4878E10479AE5E4107DC786744F32D1E659955524B24

o Windows Debugger (Windbg)
<https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/debugger/debugger-download-tools>
Getting Started with WinDbg (User-Mode)
<https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/debugger/getting-started-with-windbg>
Getting Started with WinDbg (Kernel-Mode)
<https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/debugger/getting-started-with-windbg--kernel-mode->

o Windows Symbol Packages (apparently no longer available offline):
<https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/debugger/debugger-download-symbols>

o Official Microsoft Kernel Debugging Tutorial
<https://docplayer.net/37532550-Kernel-debugging-with-windbg.html>
Name: Kernel_Debugging_Tutorial.doc
Size: 1196032 bytes (1168 KiB)
SHA256: 5A4E442B965280C791AC0AEA9D91B001AFF620F6ECF67C87AB011C1BAC673156

If those 430-grain hard-cast bear bullets don't work, there's always these:

o How to stress-test your PC hardware
<https://www.pcworld.com/article/2028882/keep-it-stable-stupid-how-to-stress-test-your-pc-hardware.html>

o 18 Top Computer Stress Test Software To Test CPU, RAM And GPU
<https://www.softwaretestinghelp.com/computer-stress-test-software/>

o Huge List of Computer Stress Test Software
<https://www.trentonsystems.com/blog/list-of-computer-stress-test-software>

o Top 8 best tools to stress test and monitor your PC
<https://pcgamehaven.com/best-tools-stress-test-monitor-pc/>

o How To Stress Test Your Hardware and Keep Your PC Stable
<https://www.tested.com/tech/pcs/762-how-to-stress-test-your-hardware-and-keep-your-pc-stable/>

o Best Tools to Stress Test Your Computer
<https://www.addictivetips.com/hardware/cpu-ram-stress-test/>

o Stress Test Your Hardware to Troubleshoot Problems
<https://lifehacker.com/stress-test-your-hardware-to-troubleshoot-problems-and-5619416>

o The freeware stress test tool HeavyLoad
<https://www.jam-software.com/heavyload>

o The 6 Best Free Programs for Stress Testing Your PC
<http://blog.logicalincrements.com/2015/12/the-best-programs-for-stress-testing-your-pc/>

o CPU Stress Test Online
<https://cpux.net/cpu-stress-test-online>

o How to Stress-Test CPUs and PCs
<https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/stress-test-cpu-pc-guide,5461-13.html>

o 15 Best Tools to Stress Test Your PC
<https://www.gearprimer.com/technology/best-tools-stress-test-pc-cpu-ram-gpu/>

o 16 Best Tools To Stress Test Your PC
<https://www.rankred.com/best-tools-stress-test-pc-cpu-gpu-ram/>

o The 11 Best Tools to Stress Test Your PC
<https://techguided.com/best-tools-to-stress-test-p-cpu-ram-gpu/>

o 8 Best Tools for Stress Testing your PC
<https://premiumbuilds.com/guides/best-tools-for-stress-testing-pc-cpu-gpu-ram/>

o Best Tools To Stress Test Your PC: RAM & CPU Stress Tests
<https://www.wepc.com/how-to/stress-test-cpu-ram/>
etc.

When hunting for bear, bring along plenty of high-grain ammo!

[Mike Easter]

x-posts eliminated to acf

Post by Arlen Holder
a. A 2GB USB stick can boot with BIOS/UEFI to Win10PE for diagnostics
a. A 2GB USB stick can boot with BIOS to WinXPMini for hardware diagnostics

My approach was to take a 4G USB stick previously used to multiboot a
couple of different linuxes and clear it w/ Rufus quick format. I had
dl/ed the H 15.2 zip 0.6G (containing .iso & other tools) and the H PE
.iso (1.3G). I then used Yumi to write the 15.2 & PE to multiboot, for
which Yumi did not offer any persistence for those .iso/s, which it
typically does for linux writes.

I booted the 15.2 first which boot gives some options and I chose to
boot into a linux environment which is an old v. of PartedMagic back at
linux 3.5.6 w/ an OpenBox WM and some parts from LXDE such as for file
manager. The environment and apps are pretty old w/ an ancient Firefox eg.

For SMART it has an older GSmart; the system info tool uses HardInfo
which has a collection of benchmarkers to use to 'stress' the cpu.
Personally, I would use a newer linux distro boot for that function,
such as SystemRescuecd, the most recent release '19 Feb running XFCE
over Arch.

It is interesting how much Hirens managed to squeeze into that 0.6G
.zip/.iso w/ linux live environment, miniXP environment, and a plethora
of DOS tools.

All of the above are freeware, rufus, yumi, and the hirens.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Mike Easter
I booted the 15.2 first which boot gives some options and I chose to
boot into a linux environment which is an old v. of PartedMagic back at
linux 3.5.6 w/ an OpenBox WM and some parts from LXDE such as for file
manager.  The environment and apps are pretty old w/ an ancient Firefox eg.
Personally, I would use a newer linux distro boot for that function,
such as SystemRescuecd, the most recent release '19 Feb running XFCE
over Arch.
It is interesting how much Hirens managed to squeeze into that 0.6G
.zip/.iso w/ linux live environment, miniXP environment, and a plethora
of DOS tools.

Since the two H are small, there was room on the usb stick for the
current systemrescuecd SR which was just released today '20 Sep 12; it
is small enough to fit on a CD at 6xx meg and comes in 32 or 64bit.

So I Yumi added SR to the 2 H/s, and it is more current, running a linux
5.4.64, current xfce 4.14, ffx 78.0 and has a collection of useful tools
but no gsmart or some other usefuls on the older SR.

I'm not sure that current SR is the best choice for a linux rescue; I'll
check out rescatux, ultimateboot, and trinity as well.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Mike Easter
I'm not sure that current SR is the best choice for a linux rescue; I'll
check out rescatux, ultimateboot, and trinity as well.

The field is thinning out. The current PartedMagic is payware since
2012; Trinity is discontinued; UBCD isn't actually a linux rescue, but a
bootable collection of tools which would run from floppy, so Rescatux is
up.

Rescatux is not a conventional rescue such as PartedMagic or SR, but
instead is based on its wizard interface of rescapp for numerous purposes.

I'm still browsing around to see if some other choices arise.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Mike Easter
Rescatux is not a conventional rescue such as PartedMagic or SR, but
instead is based on its wizard interface of rescapp for numerous purposes.

That rescapp is 'quaint' - a graphical tool for performing a number of
operations which would otherwise be run from a command, the first
example being inxi, which results are sent to a log file in a log dir.

The distro itself is based on Deb stable, so the kernel is back at 4.19;
LXQt is on top; synaptic is installed by default so one has easy access
to the Deb repos so as to install the myriad deb packages, such as
gsmartcontrol for graphical management of the SMART situation.

What is most helpful about rescapp is how its help and documentation is
structured, which seems to be very newbie oriented, but since the
interface is completely different/foreign, the assumption that
'everyone' is a newbie is valid.

Some of the 'fixing' functions are basically on auto-pilot, which I'm
not sure is always a good idea, so some of that should be used w/
caution, lest one break something worse than the original problem.

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Mike Easter
Some of the 'fixing' functions are basically on auto-pilot, which I'm
not sure is always a good idea, so some of that should be used w/
caution, lest one break something worse than the original problem.

Hi Mike,
You're way (way) ahead of me on building USB live distros, where I have
been concentrating on that PC Magazine article on stress testing freeware.

I ran all the programs for hours, but haven't posted the screenshots yet.
o Offhand, this is what I'm working on (this is just my log file below).

Writing up the tutorial takes much longer than just running the apps.

I did EVERYTHING recommended in this article:
https://www.pcworld.com/article/2028882/keep-it-stable-stupid-how-to-stress-test-your-pc-hardware.html

o CPU monitor
Keep the CPUID HW Monitor open during all stress tests
https://www.pcworld.com/article/2028882/keep-it-stable-stupid-how-to-stress-test-your-pc-hardware.html
http://download.cpuid.com/hwmonitor/hwmonitor_1.42.exe
Name: hwmonitor_1.42.exe
Size: 1311920 bytes (1281 KiB)
SHA256: 9E144CB22BAB8B94B26753B60382FBF7ACB86F03F2BA0CF092AABD8E73918DA7
C:\Program Files\CPUID\HWMonitor
C:\app\hardware\cpu\cpuid

o CPU & Memory stress test
https://www.mersenne.org/download/
http://www.mersenne.org/ftp_root/gimps/p95v298b6.win64.zip
Name: prime95.exe
Size: 37431296 bytes (35 MiB)
SHA256: 732B3BB0CE5C434C4393830F133477F36F5BCC92D4FD9A9D8E83F0F16DD96ECF

C:\app\hardware\cpu\prime95

Open the program, then head to Options > Torture Test
Many people use the Blend test.
Blend stresses both the CPU and RAM; if no errors pop up after four hours
or so, you can consider it stable for normal use.

Alternatively, the Small FFT and Large FFT torture tests lay off the RAM
a bit to subject the CPU to as much respective stress and heat as possible.


o CPU stress test
IntelBurnTest
Works with Intel and AMD CPUs despite the name.

https://www.pcworld.com/article/2028882/keep-it-stable-stupid-how-to-stress-test-your-pc-hardware.html
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?197835-IntelBurnTest-The-new-stress-testing-program
https://www.techpowerup.com/download/intelburntest/
https://us2-dl.techpowerup.com/files/vsire48fIKtmUjJJ-7Pf9A/1599893283/Intel-Burn-Test-2.54.zip
Name: IntelBurnTestV2.exe
Size: 82432 bytes (80 KiB)
SHA256: 5B84A3508686837EEC336A933C30DCD55BB9CEDF5E7F79FA0F8E1E479544ACFF
Requires .NET Framework 3.5 which it will install upon first invocation.

o CPU, GPU, Memory, GPU Memory & Power supply stress test
OCCT
https://www.ocbase.com/
https://www.ocbase.com/download
Name: OCCT6.2.0.exe
Size: 20122344 bytes (19 MiB)
SHA256: A6D1D41197A181AB76364F535EE11E3FF950FAC216118EF4618414CDB9FC1039

I like this app a lot. Very nice interface, at least upon first use.

Memory
Memtest86+
https://www.pcworld.com/article/232640/memtest86.html
I covered installing to a USB stick & running it already.


o Video stress test
Furmark (also runs GPU-Z & GPU-Shark)
https://geeks3d.com/furmark/
https://geeks3d.com/furmark/downloads/
https://geeks3d.com/downloads/2020p/FurMark_1.21.2.0_Setup.exe
Name: FurMark_1.21.2.0_Setup.exe
Size: 12192665 bytes (11 MiB)
SHA256: 593BCB8C4BBD772A247704AB5E82B4BB04C039F8014A7B5B04E1E48BF498D751
C:\Program Files (x86)\Geeks3D\Benchmarks\FurMark
C:\app\hardware\video\furmark

Keep an eye on HWMonitor and/or SpeedFan as FurMark gets your
GPU very hot, very quickly. You won't need to run FurMark for long.
If your graphics card is going to crash or start tossing out
funky visual artifacts, it will do so within 15 to 30 minutes.

There's a button to download GPU-Z which I clicked & it downloaded:
https://www.techpowerup.com/download/techpowerup-gpu-z/
https://us4-dl.techpowerup.com/files/TMzfhts2SgdDQcZRSMg6fg/1599895027/GPU-Z.2.34.0.exe
Name: GPU-Z.2.34.0.exe
Size: 8060888 bytes (7871 KiB)
SHA256: 83F9A53AEBD0A381887D8F4FF07032477194BE3BE79C1C242A39F09623E79B93


GPU stress testing
Valley
https://benchmark.unigine.com/
https://benchmark.unigine.com/valley
https://m11-assets.unigine.com/d/Unigine_Valley-1.0.exe
Name: Unigine_Valley-1.0.exe
Size: 359192645 bytes (342 MiB)
SHA256: 30ADCC19B9C2B565CCE20715DF02ACA42303F96858ED28A5168DA520B0BB46A7
C:\Program Files (x86)\Unigine\Valley Benchmark 1.0
C:\app\hardware\gpu\valley


GPU DirectX-11 benchmark
aliens-vs-predator
https://www.techpowerup.com/download/avp-aliens-vs-predator-directx-11-benchmark/
https://us2-dl.techpowerup.com/files/1h6knUbcuWjPm1_VIztCKQ/1599895349/aliens-vs-predator-D3D11-Benchmark-v1.03.msi
Name: aliens-vs-predator-D3D11-Benchmark-v1.03.msi
Size: 318512128 bytes (303 MiB)
SHA256: 384C80CD8ED1BAD8842ED9AEA00DDC71001EDE614979B7DFD67BA0AEC3EFFA6B
C:\Program Files (x86)\Rebellion\AvP D3D11 Benchmark\
C:\app\hardware\gpu\alien-vs-predator
install failed, dunno why, I didn' bother debugging why.

GPU DirectX-11 benchmark
stalker
https://cop.stalker-game.com/?page=benchmark
http://files.gsc-game.com/st/bench/stkcop-bench-setup.exe
Name: stkcop-bench-setup.exe
Size: 443790904 bytes (423 MiB)
SHA256: 392AF077087759AC622DA1F861A95B28B6FD22544D73B920C1B7198E4EC419BF

[Mike Easter]

I have been concentrating on that PC Magazine article on stress
testing freeware.

One point that article developed was the 'difference' between stress
testing and benchmarking. When I was looking around for tools to
address your idea and subject of 'stress testing', I was only familiar
with ram testing 'stressfully' while other softwares I was seeing seemed
to be calling their purposes 'benchmarking'.

In the linux world, the strong (but elaborate) bench testing suite is
that of Phoronix, and I considered that suite for you to boot into a
linux environment to accomplish.

But the PC article clarifies the different aims of benchtesting vs
stress testing. In his article Chacos considers stress testing to be
the kind of operation that one might do with new equipment to ensure
reliability and stability as opposed to benchmarking whose purpose is to
rate or rank something for its speed as described in an alternate
referred PC article by Case. Case's article also notes that
benchmarking can also be used to stress test a system. One purpose of
stress testing is to 'burn' in something while it is under warranty.

Those articles brought home to me a refurb/ed laptop I purchased a while
back. While the refurb looked new, when I was checking it out, I found
that the cpu ran pretty warm/hot. I took it back and exchanged it for
another same like-new refurb whose cpu temp ran normal. What I *failed*
to test during that time was its ethernet speed test, which is supposed
to be gigabit, but instead is dismal, no faster than its wifi.

The Chacos article talks about monitoring the temps, voltages, and fan
speed while stressing the various parts of ram, cpu, graphics and the
usefulness of the SMART hdd exam.

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Mike Easter
One point that article developed was the 'difference' between stress
testing and benchmarking.

Agreed. It was irksome in my searches that they're all lumped together.
o Reporting tools, e.g., speedfan, CPU-Z, GPU-Z, CPUID-HWmonitor, etc.
o Benchmarking tools, e.g., Unigine Valley, stalker, aliens-predator, etc.
o Stressing tools, e.g., memtest86, prime95.exe, IntelBurn, Furmark, etc.

Post by Mike Easter
When I was looking around for tools to
address your idea and subject of 'stress testing', I was only familiar
with ram testing 'stressfully' while other softwares I was seeing seemed
to be calling their purposes 'benchmarking'.

Somewhere elsewhere I saw you can only stress test certain things:
o RAM
o CPU
o GPU

That was about it; but what I really want is a "test" tool that tests, oh,
say, the motherboard, and the cmos clock voltage, and the temperature, and
fan speeds, and current flow, and reliability of the connectors, etc.

In a way, the tests above do do that, but in a general sense, more so than
specific tests aimed at testing every capacitor & cable connection.

Post by Mike Easter
In the linux world, the strong (but elaborate) bench testing suite is
that of Phoronix, and I considered that suite for you to boot into a
linux environment to accomplish.

This is good to know, as I'll keep it in mind.
o I'm not at all against booting to Linux, but the BSODs are only on
Windows, but that may be only because I'm mostly on Windows nowadays.

Post by Mike Easter
The Chacos article talks about monitoring the temps, voltages, and fan
speed while stressing the various parts of ram, cpu, graphics and the
usefulness of the SMART hdd exam.

Yes. I had the "reporting" tools running simultaneously with the stressing
tools, and so far I haven't noticed anything out of the ordinary, even as I
ran every test (except for the aliens-versus-predator, which failed to
install and I didn't bother trying to debug as I moved on to Furmark
instead, which the PC Magazine article said was a pretty stressful
benchmark test anyway).

[Mike Easter]

Post by Arlen Holder
I'm not at all against booting to Linux, but the BSODs are only on
Windows, but that may be only because I'm mostly on Windows nowadays.

There is a problem w/ 'focus' in your issue.

- this BSOD business is apparently exclusively Win
- almost as a red herring we discuss POSTing issues
- those two *different* issues overlap/confusion should be eliminated

Is POSTing now no longer a problem? Apparently, since you have had all
manner of 'working' time performing all these stress tests.

If POSTing is now no longer a problem and running alternate systems such
as mini10 and miniXP and linux live and DOS programs, all of which are
run from live USB, then the focus changes from hardware to the hdd
install performance of a Win install.

I run a live linux w/o (or w/) persistence for months at a time. If
there were something 'wrong w/' my hardware during those months,
something would happen, unless my hardware's problem were some kind of
hdd issue which was not discovered by the SMART info, since live linux
doesn't have any need for the hdd.

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Mike Easter
There is a problem w/ 'focus' in your issue.

Hi Mike,

You're reasonable in your assessment for sure, which I appreciate.
o You don't jump to conclusions sans data supporting your assessments.

I don't disagree with anything you've said above or ever on this quest.
o But notice I've changed my dirty habits a lot (see below) over time!

And that seems to have made a _huge_ (positive) difference in the BSODs!
o And specifically, in the BSOD's subsequent ill effect on POST & BOOT!

We probably should mention with respect to the POST issues is that I've
been "fixing" things all along, e.g., I replaced the mouse and keyboard;
and I learned long ago not to leave anything in the USB ports; and I
disconnected the Nvidia graphics card for the longest time as its fan was
noisy which I oiled & cleaned; likewise I disconnected the cables to the
DVD burner for the longest time (until I needed it to boot to Knoppix); and
I removed any and all extraneous hardware like USB ports to the monitor;
and I replaced the cmos battery (which wiped out the BIOS settings); and I
replaced all the cables that I could (i.e., the SATA cable to the HDD); and
I cleaned out the fans; and I reseated the memory and Nvidia board multiple
times; and I wiggled every cable; and I moved all the cables I could (e.g.,
the SATA cables) to a different connector on the motherboard; and I set up
Windows to not ever reboot automatically; and I set up Windows to not use
fastboot and hibernation (all from memory so there's as likely just as much
more that I forgot I did).

The PC is acting EXTREMELY DIFFERENTLY lately than it did before!

For one, I haven't seen the POST error in months, even as it happened
multiple times, where the POST error always seemed to happen AFTER a BSOD
error and it came at a time when I wasn't aware that booting off the PC
when shut down but with the power on to the Motherboard (as indicated by a
green LED on the motherboard) was (apparently) different than booting under
the exact same conditions with the power completely turned off (I used to
pull the plug but I added a power strip with an on/off switch) such that I
never boot the PC anymore without ensuring the light on the motherboard is
off at least for a second before I apply power to the PC power supply.

For another, while the OS was so badly corrupted that I've re-imaged it
(i.e., formatted & re-installed Windows from scratch) three or four times,
I learned that this corruption DOES NOT HAPPEN if...

This Windows boot corruption does not (seem to) happen if I NEVER NEVER
NEVER let the machine boot itself after a BSOD! It's an iron-clad rule that
I've learned the hard way!

When the BSOD happens, I turn off the power off, and pull the 120VAC plug
until the motherboard LED goes out (takes at least a minute or so).

Also, I learned that you have to TURN OFF FASTBOOT & HIBERNATION, and I
even turned of SLEEP, so that the PC is never booting to a funky stage that
is halfway between fully running and fully off.

Whenever the BSOD happens, every boot is from a fully off in two ways:
1. The OS starts from 0 (i.e., it's not a fastboot or hibernation or sleep)
2. I do not let it ever automatically reboot (never never never) anymore.

That alone, I think, eliminated "most" of the times that the machine
wouldn't reboot after a BSOD (which I was getting at the rate of a few a
week, more sometimes, less sometimes).

For a third thing, I have been consistently making restore points, where I
do it so often now that I want to script it into a batch file single
command:
o Win+R batch command to create a system restore point
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.msdos.batch/MLUpbsCh8tI>

Whenever the OS won't boot after a BSOD (which is in about half of the
BSODs now), then I simply revert to that restore point, and I am fine.

In summary, I think there was a CASCADE of errors, which chewed up the
operating system, which chewed up the POST process, but don't ask me how
that could possibly happen because the POST should be completely separate
from the operating system, should it not?

All I know is that the BSODs still happen, but much less frequently (I
haven't had even once since I began the stress tests, for example), and,
that when they do happen, most of the time the machine can be rebooted
(note that I have a specific coldstart reboot process now), and in the one
out of ten or twenty now cases where the OS is so badly corrupted it won't
boot, the restore point, lately, has been restoring it such that I haven't
had to rebuild the operating system from scratch in a month or so.

Post by Mike Easter
- this BSOD business is apparently exclusively Win
- almost as a red herring we discuss POSTing issues
- those two *different* issues overlap/confusion should be eliminated
Is POSTing now no longer a problem? Apparently, since you have had all
manner of 'working' time performing all these stress tests.

See above.
a. I don't see how the POST "could" be related to the BSOD
b. Unless they're both caused by the same hardware problem
c. But I haven't had the POST issue in a couple of months

Post by Mike Easter
If POSTing is now no longer a problem and running alternate systems such
as mini10 and miniXP and linux live and DOS programs, all of which are
run from live USB, then the focus changes from hardware to the hdd
install performance of a Win install.

I don't disagree where I regret that I didn't use a DIFFERENT HDD to
re-install Windows on, as it could be a flaky HDD but we did test the HDD
with the WD Diagnostic (and other) tools and it came up perfectly clean
(it's not old - maybe a year or two old).

Post by Mike Easter
I run a live linux w/o (or w/) persistence for months at a time. If
there were something 'wrong w/' my hardware during those months,
something would happen, unless my hardware's problem were some kind of
hdd issue which was not discovered by the SMART info, since live linux
doesn't have any need for the hdd.

It has been clean since I started the stress testing.

Maybe it got scared. :)

I expect a BSOD soon, and when it happens, I'll go back to the tools here:
o Windows BSOD analysis - A thorough usage guide
<https://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/windows-bsod.html>

When the next BSOD happens, I hope to dig into those "minidump" logs.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Arlen Holder
Whenever the OS won't boot after a BSOD (which is in about half of the
BSODs now), then I simply revert to that restore point, and I am fine.

What exactly does that mean 'won't boot' (after BSOD)?

How exactly does the boot fail?:
- the machine POSTs properly
- the Win boot mgr finishes
- some kind of Win screen appears, but never completes
- or what?

[pez]

"Mike Easter" <***@ster.invalid> wrote in message news:***@mid.individual.net...
| Arlen Holder wrote:
| > Whenever the OS won't boot after a BSOD (which is in about half of the
| > BSODs now), then I simply revert to that restore point, and I am fine.
|
| What exactly does that mean 'won't boot' (after BSOD)?
|
| How exactly does the boot fail?:
| - the machine POSTs properly
| - the Win boot mgr finishes
| - some kind of Win screen appears, but never completes
| - or what?
|
| --
| Mike Easter
=

- A Volume License Product Key perhaps ?

[pez]

|"Mike Easter" <***@ster.invalid> wrote in message news:***@mid.individual.net...
| Arlen Holder wrote:
|>Whenever the OS won't boot after a BSOD (which is in about half of the
|>BSODs now), then I simply revert to that restore point, and I am fine.
|
| What exactly does that mean 'won't boot' (after BSOD)?
|
| How exactly does the boot fail?:
| - the machine POSTs properly
| - the Win boot mgr finishes
| - some kind of Win screen appears, but never completes
| - or what?
|
| --
| Mike Easter
==
|"pez" <***@gmail.com> wrote in message news:***@mid.individual.net...
|
| A Volume License Product Key perhaps ?
=

- Already Registered ?

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Mike Easter
What exactly does that mean 'won't boot' (after BSOD)?
- the machine POSTs properly
- the Win boot mgr finishes
- some kind of Win screen appears, but never completes
- or what?

Hi Mike,
It's confusing.
o And, whatever I say, may be wrong just 'cuz it's random'ish.

Also, there is a CRITICAL untested factor I forgot to mention:
o I haven't re-used the Nvidia graphics card yet (nor tested)

Outside of that, what "seems" to happen now after a BSOD is very different
than what used to consistently happen after a BSOD, which is important,
because, I think, it wasn't so much the BSOD that ate up the bootable
portion of the HDD but what happened AFTER the BSOD.

So we need a then and now, where I'll explain what has been happening in
the past ten BSODs (a couple of weeks) but bear in mind I've had zero BSODs
since I added the minidump crash debuggers suggested in
o Windows BSOD analysis - A thorough usage guide
<https://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/windows-bsod.html>

First, some hints for others to disable stuff that hurts rebooting:
o To disable autostart after updates:
Win+R > %windir%\system32\taskschd.msc /s {ctrl+shft+enter}
Win+R > cmd {ctrl+shift+enter} > %windir%\system32\taskschd.msc /s
Task Scheduler Library > Microsoft > Windows > UpdateOrchestrator
Right click on the task named "Reboot_AC" & click "Disable" to disable.

o To disable autostart after crashes:
Win+R > control.exe {ctrl+shift+enter}
View by: Category
System and Security > System > Advanced System Settings
Bring up Startup & Recovery settings:
Startup and Recovery > Settings
Uncheck the system failure automatically-restart option:
System failure
[x]Write an event to the system log
[_]Automatically restart
OK > OK

o To turn off faststartup (i.e., fastboot) & hibernate
powercfg /h /type reduced
powercfg /h /type full
Win+R > powercfg.cpl > Choose what the power buttons do >
Change settings that are currently unavailable >
Shutdown settings
DEFAULT:
[x]Turn on fast startup (recommended)
[x]Sleep
[_]Hibernate
[x]Lock
Change to:
[_]Turn on fast startup (recommended)
[x]Sleep
[_]Hibernate
[x]Lock
Note you can have "hibernate" (reduced) without "faststartup";
but you can't have fast startup without hibernate (full or reduced).

o Disable sleep
Note there are two types of sleep: Hybrid Sleep mode.
Win+R > powercfg.cpl
Change when the computer sleeps
DEFAULT:
Turn off the display > 10 minutes
Put the computer to sleep > 30 minutes
Change to:
Turn off the display > Never
Put the computer to sleep > Never
Sleep > allow hybrid sleep = Off
Change advanced power settings (note 0 means never).
Note: Sleep stores in RAM what Hibernate stores in "Hiberfile.sys".

Lately:
1. I'm happily humming away for days on the PC in Windows 10 Pro latest.
2. BSOD! (the first one is usually a "kernel" error, as I recall)
<Loading Image...>
3. The machine is set to not hibernate, not fastboot, not sleep.
4. The machine is set to not reboot automatically.
5. So the machine just sits there staring dumbly aloof
6. I kill power to the machine in two stages (machine then power strip)
7. I wait until the green LED goes off on the motherboard (1 minute)
8. I cross my fingers, and boot cold.

Almost all the time now, the machine boots to the login screen.
o If necessary, I restore to the previous restore point.

Before:
1. I'm happily humming away for days on the PC in Windows 10 Pro latest.
2. BSOD!
<https://i.postimg.cc/9Q4m7tfM/bsod01.jpg> [UNEXPECTED KERNEL MODE TRAP]
3. The thing reboots, and a _different_ BSOD shows up, maybe:
<Loading Image...> [KERNEL SECURITY CHECK FAILURE]
4. Each time could be yet another BSOD shows up, maybe:
<Loading Image...> [MEMORY MANAGEMENT]
5. At some point, the machine reverts to trying to fix itself:
<Loading Image...> [Preparing Automatic Repair]
<Loading Image...> [Diagnosing your PC]
<Loading Image...> [Automatic Repair?]
<Loading Image...> [Automatic Repair failed]
<Loading Image...> [Reset your PC]
<Loading Image...> [Booting, ferris dots]
<Loading Image...> [Lock screen success
6. That success is when I'm lucky; if I'm not lucky, POST fails:
<https://i.postimg.cc/zGpQ89NH/bsod11.jpg> [POST STOPS BEFORE FINISHING]

But that hasn't happened since I disabled the things that seem to chew up
the operating system when the OS is suddenly shut down from a BSOD.

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Arlen Holder
Almost all the time now, the machine boots to the login screen.

I should clarify _why_ it boots directly to the login & not lock screen:

Eliminate the lock screen upon startup & go right to the login prompt:
1. Regedit [HKLM\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows]
2. Add a New Key => Personalization
3. Add to it a New 32-bit DWORD -> NoLockScreen
4. Set the Value = 1

Summary:
HKLM\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\Personalization > NoLockScreen = 1

[Mike Easter]

Post by Arlen Holder
o Windows BSOD analysis - A thorough usage guide
<https://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/windows-bsod.html>

10y ago, Igor did an even more extensive workup on kernel panic in linux
and he put it into a .pdf book Linux Kernel Crash Book - Everything You
Need to Know almost 5 meg.

He also has a series of 7 accompanying articles on his site,
particularly https://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/crash-analyze.html
which is mostly about the linux crash utility. That article also has a
sentence or two mentioning the hardware inspection role.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Arlen Holder
1. I'm happily humming away for days on the PC in Windows 10 Pro latest.
2. BSOD! (the first one is usually a "kernel" error, as I recall)
<https://i.postimg.cc/9Q4m7tfM/bsod01.jpg>
3. The machine is set to not hibernate, not fastboot, not sleep.
4. The machine is set to not reboot automatically.
5. So the machine just sits there staring dumbly aloof
6. I kill power to the machine in two stages (machine then power strip)
7. I wait until the green LED goes off on the motherboard (1 minute)
8. I cross my fingers, and boot cold.
Almost all the time now, the machine boots to the login screen.
o If necessary, I restore to the previous restore point.

But, all of that means that you have been tweaking the install with all
of your myriad tweaks/changes for the past xx days, yes?

That is, this isn't a 'virgin' win10pro that is bsod/ing, it is a arlen
frankenholder win10pro, nicht wahr?

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Mike Easter
That is, this isn't a 'virgin' win10pro that is bsod/ing, it is a arlen
frankenholder win10pro, nicht wahr?

Das ist richtig Herr Easter!
o You might wonder why I haven't responded all day, Mike.

I got my first BSOD in days, this morning, when I woke up.
o It took me about six hours of repetitive booting to get the OS back.

By the time I booted to a stable OS, I had a dozen handwritten pages of
what happened, where I've been up and alive for, oh, about three hours now,
but it took me six hours to be booted to a stable OS.
(I need to write the steps up separately, so that others can benefit.)

I must have booted twenty to thirty times in that process, where I
documented every step with a photo if I could (some flashed by too fast).

Here's just the short summary of my day today...

o This is the PC hardware:
<Loading Image...>

o This is just some of the dozen pages of steps it took to boot today:
<Loading Image...>

o BSOD #1 (with white lines) SYSTEM SERVICE EXCEPTION
<Loading Image...>

o BSOD #2 (with white lines) SYSTEM THREAD EXCEPTION NOT HANDLED
<Loading Image...>

o BSOD #3 SYSTEM THREAD EXCEPTION NOT HANDLED
<Loading Image...>

o BSOD #4 (just the white lines)
<Loading Image...>

o BSOD #5 (with white lines) DRIVER OVERRAN STACK BUFFER
<Loading Image...>

o BSOD #6 KERNEL SECURITY CHECK FAILURE
<Loading Image...>

o Choosing the latest restore point:
<Loading Image...>

o Back to Windows 10 again, like nothing ever happened:
<Loading Image...>

Now, it's working just fine!

[Mike Easter]

Post by Arlen Holder

Post by Mike Easter
That is, this isn't a 'virgin' win10pro that is bsod/ing, it is a arlen
frankenholder win10pro, nicht wahr?

Das ist richtig Herr Easter!
<https://i.postimg.cc/bwqFY4LV/bsod210.jpg>

That is a significantly mod/ed Win10.

My point is that in a simple works vs doesn't work dichotomy, having a
simple working model as a basis of comparison to a non-working model
helps to isolate a problem.

In this/your scenario, we aren't even 100% confident of the hardware
integrity, except that various testing methods are negative. So, it
could be something like a bad cap that isn't visible/distorted.

Second or also, we haven't seen some 'reliable' system work for an
extended period of time, say a week. By reliable, I mean such as a live
linux or even a live H PE. Such a running clean live for a week would
give more confidence that there wasn't some kind of unpredictable
hardware condition such as a bad mobo cap.

But, instead, you start w/ a clean W10, then you mod it significantly
and then you get your BSOD which we don't know is caused by mobo, hdd,
or win10 + tweaks software. Then you have to hope that you can develop
the skills to examine Who Crashed, BlueScreenView, or Windbg and find
some answer.

I think such dump examinations are going to be exceedingly difficult.

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Mike Easter
That is a significantly mod/ed Win10.

Hi Mike,

I appreciate that you have a great grasp of the problem set.
o And that your advice is 100% on the mark

It's not a bare-bones Windows system that I'm using for the past year
o The GUI is customized to be efficient & apps are installed to be used
<Loading Image...>

I use Windows; it's not just a screensaver display; it's in use all day.
o In fact, it hasn't crashed since yesterday morning & has been stressed
<Loading Image...>

But when it BSOD'd yesterday, it took 12 pages of steps to get it back!
o <Loading Image...>

Unfortunately, I had to hone the log-saving setup after the BSOD happened:
o Win+R > msconfig > General > Startup selection
(_)Normal startup
(o)Diagnostic startup
(_)Selective startup

Enable minidumps:
o Win+R > sysdm.cpl > Advanced > Startup and Recovery > Settings >
System failure
[x]Write an event to the system log
[_]Automatically restart
Write debugging information
[none]
[Small memory dump]
[Kernel memory dump]
[Complete memory dump]
[Automatic memory dump] <== select this for Win10
[Active memory dump]
Dump file:
%SystemRoot%\MEMORY.DMP
[_]Overwrite any existing file
[x]Disable automatic deletion of memory dumps when disk space is low
etc.

Post by Mike Easter
My point is that in a simple works vs doesn't work dichotomy, having a
simple working model as a basis of comparison to a non-working model
helps to isolate a problem.

Agreed.
o But Windows is what I use to get things done.

So "stuff" is gonna have to be added.
o In general, apps don't cause "Stop Errors" (hardware & drivers do).

Post by Mike Easter
In this/your scenario, we aren't even 100% confident of the hardware
integrity, except that various testing methods are negative. So, it
could be something like a bad cap that isn't visible/distorted.

There's a reason I opened this thread hoping to find a "bad cap" tester:
o What PC hardware diagnostic stress-testing freeware can you recommend?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.freeware/dkkdOmL95d8>

So far we can only easily stress test CPUs, Memory, & GPUs (it seems).
o What we need is a "circuit board" testing suite of some sort
<Loading Image...>

Post by Mike Easter
Second or also, we haven't seen some 'reliable' system work for an
extended period of time, say a week. By reliable, I mean such as a live
linux or even a live H PE. Such a running clean live for a week would
give more confidence that there wasn't some kind of unpredictable
hardware condition such as a bad mobo cap.

Agreed.
o But this is my daily driver so I need to get work done.

I _tried_ to get work done on a live Ubuntu - but it was too darn slow.

Post by Mike Easter
But, instead, you start w/ a clean W10, then you mod it significantly
and then you get your BSOD which we don't know is caused by mobo, hdd,
or win10 + tweaks software.

Most likely, according to the cites I've already provided, a BSOD
o is usually caused by hardware about half the time, and,
o by drivers the other half of the time.

Neither one of which "should" be affected by a hundred tweaks to Windows.
o <Loading Image...>

Post by Mike Easter
Then you have to hope that you can develop
the skills to examine Who Crashed, BlueScreenView, or Windbg and find
some answer.

Rest assured, I'm working on it, but, unfortunately, no log was saved!
o It turns out Windows is pretty damn choosy as to how it's set up.

For example...
o The page file must be on the same drive as your operating system
o The page file base allocation size must be greater than RAM
o Windows Error Reporting (WER) system service should be set to MANUAL
o Set page file to system managed on the OS drive
o Set system crash/recovery options to "kernel memory dump"
o User account control must be running.
o Sometimes SSD drives with older firmware do not create DMPS
o Cleaner applications like Ccleaner delete DMP files.
etc.

BTW, I also ran a series of de rigueur cleanups, all of which ran clean:
o For example, I ran scannow 3 times, then dism, then scannow a fourth time

From my logs (see the thread on creating a usb stick set of pc-specific logs):
o What solution do you use to figure out what USB drive letter in a Windows scripted command?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.msdos.batch/fjxhOsMvJkY>

Here's a cut-and-paste of steps from those pc-specific usb-portable logs:

o Win+R > cmd {control+shift+enter}
sfc /scannow
Windows Resource Protection could not start the repair service.
sc config trustedinstaller start= auto [SC] ChangeServiceConfig SUCCESS
net start trustedinstaller
The Windows Modules Installer service is starting.
The Windows Modules Installer service was started successfully.
sfc /scannow
Beginning system scan. This process will take some time.
Beginning verification phase of system scan.
sfc /scannow
sfc /scannow
Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /CheckHealth
DISM /Online /Cleanup-Image /RestoreHealth
sfc /scannow

Post by Mike Easter
I think such dump examinations are going to be exceedingly difficult.

I'm also learning how to use Microsoft SetupDiag to analyze minidump files:
o <https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/deployment/upgrade/setupdiag>

There is also a Microsoft Windows Performance Recorder I'm testing out:
o <https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-update/windows-performance-recorder/a1648e8c-50c7-4243-9f1d-4216385c7ff3>

As shown in this screenshot below:
o <https://i.postimg.cc/YCZHCSnD/bsod212.jpg>

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Arlen Holder
o In general, apps don't cause "Stop Errors" (hardware & drivers do).

To be clear, I get that BSOD-causality information from the literature:
o <https://www.howtogeek.com/163452/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-blue-screen-of-death/>
"Blue screens are generally caused by problems with your computer's
hardware or issues with its hardware driver software. Sometimes, they
can be caused by issues with low-level software running in the Windows
kernel. Regular apps usually won't be able to cause blue screens.
If an app crashes, it will do so without taking the operating system
out with it."

While that one doesn't fault apps, this one below also implicates apps:

o <https://www.lmeservices.com/fix-the-dreaded-bsod/>
"The BSOD can be caused by Hardware - A faulty memory module,
bad sectors on your hard drive or possibly a toasty graphics card
The BSOD can be caused by Software ¡V A corrupted operating system,
faulty hardware drivers or some kind of malicious app"

I have tested the drivers, albeit Verifier makes the machine verrry slow!
o <https://i.postimg.cc/vTnqk9GC/bsod100.jpg>

For example, from my syslogs...
o Win+R > verifier {control+shift+enter}
<https://i.postimg.cc/vTnqk9GC/bsod100.jpg>
Configure that Windows Driver Verifier Manager
o Create standard settings > Next
o Automatically select all drivers installed on this computer > Finish
o Win+R > shutdown.exe /r /f /t 5 /c "Reboot in 5 seconds!"

[Mike Easter]

Post by Arlen Holder
But this is my daily driver so I need to get work done.

I'm prone to buy cheap hardware and keep it forever, until something
breaks that I can't fix. The last hardware I had that died was an old
eMachines Vista laptop bios'08 - died w/ black screen. Too much trouble
to disassemble and troubleshoot.

I still have running hardware
- inherited Dell laptop PentM 1G ram BIOS '06 (never use)
- OEM Compaq desk AMD 2G bios'06
- build MSI mobo AMD 8G bios'16
- 2 OEM desk HP refurb/s AMD 8G bios'11
- OEM Lenovo lap refurb AMD 7.3G bios'13
- RPi 3B ARM BCM 1G bios?

2 are 14 y/o, 3 7-9 y/o, & 2 4 y/o by bios, not by purchase hx. And, I
only have 36G ram between the 7, w/ 4 of them having total 32G at 8G
apiece and 3 having total of 4G between them.

Typically my 'daily driver' is a live linux on one of those 8G HPs, but
any one of the 3 8G desktops from 4-9 y/o would do fine.

I think that if I only had one machine to work w/, I would add an RPi4
w/ 4G ram as a spare. I only have 3 monitors here; 2 of them serve 4
machines via 2 KVM switches and one is used by the RPi3B by itself.

However, that RPi would be running a linux, not Win. The one machine I
have w/ a Win10 license is that Lenovo laptop, which I upped to 8G, but
I don' like Win10 on it, so I run something like MX or more recently the
latest Knoppix 8.6.1 which has an interesting KDE.

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Mike Easter
I'm prone to buy cheap hardware and keep it forever, until something
breaks that I can't fix.

Hi Mike,

You'll be glad to know, other than that horrid BSOD yesterday, the machine
has been running and booting without problem, since then.

There's "something" "somewhere" "somehow" that's causing this BSOD.
o But what?

Anyway, to your point above about keeping hardware forever, I am similar to
you in that I keep what works (fixing it as needed, whether that's my wife,
my house, my car, my job, my pool equipment, my kids, their kids, etc.

Post by Mike Easter
The last hardware I had that died was an old
eMachines Vista laptop bios'08 - died w/ black screen. Too much trouble
to disassemble and troubleshoot.

I'm handy, like you.
o For example, I replace my own clutches, brakes, & mount my own tires.

I even balance the wheels at home.
o Being handy is what I was taught is part of being an American.

What I love is I find a LOT of answers for fixing things, on Usenet, e.g.,
o Here are just some of the threads related to wheels & tires, on Usenet...

o Questions about mounting & balancing new LT tires on new steel rims
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.autos.tech/J5-7TxdDpBw>

o Just mounted & static balanced my 30th tire in about five years - saving over $400
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.autos.tech/ameCXs0Smdw>

o Two simple questions that came up when mounting tires at home
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.autos.tech/kuQg2H5jbs8>

o Clare - are smaller car tires easier to balance than SUV tires?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.home.repair/So4om4fLtmI>

o Clare, Xeno.... did you ever have a batch of tires that just wouldn't seal after the final bead?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.autos.tech/n4bqsqo6ObY>

o Does the macadem road surface have a great effect on tire wear?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.autos.tech/SPr6zNEDYDs>

o How would you run a lateral acceleration test in a vehicle on twisty roads at no more than 40mph?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.autos.tech/x7pwhNCqlCo>

o Why can't people figure out warp versus runout versus disc thickness variation
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.autos.tech/F-ptM5J_huQ>

Post by Mike Easter
I still have running hardware
- inherited Dell laptop PentM 1G ram BIOS '06 (never use)
- OEM Compaq desk AMD 2G bios'06
- build MSI mobo AMD 8G bios'16
- 2 OEM desk HP refurb/s AMD 8G bios'11
- OEM Lenovo lap refurb AMD 7.3G bios'13
- RPi 3B ARM BCM 1G bios?

I have cars that are two decades old, still running just fine.
o I don't ditch my wife just because she's twenty years old you know! :)

Post by Mike Easter
Typically my 'daily driver' is a live linux on one of those 8G HPs, but
any one of the 3 8G desktops from 4-9 y/o would do fine.

I had Linux as my daily drive for years (CentOS since I used it for work
stuff which ran on RedHat, and then Ubuntu when I was on my own).

Linux is great.
o IMHO Linux only suffers from missing one, and only one, key product.

Post by Mike Easter
I think that if I only had one machine to work w/, I would add an RPi4
w/ 4G ram as a spare. I only have 3 monitors here; 2 of them serve 4
machines via 2 KVM switches and one is used by the RPi3B by itself.

I find having a spare with computers, as with cars, is important when you
fix everything yourself (neither my cars nor computers are new).

Post by Mike Easter
However, that RPi would be running a linux, not Win. The one machine I
have w/ a Win10 license is that Lenovo laptop, which I upped to 8G, but
I don' like Win10 on it, so I run something like MX or more recently the
latest Knoppix 8.6.1 which has an interesting KDE.

I predicted, long ago, Linux would kill Windows, and yet, it didn't.
o At least not in the consumer desktop market it didn't.

I still don't really know why.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Arlen Holder
You'll be glad to know, other than that horrid BSOD yesterday, the machine
has been running and booting without problem, since then.
There's "something" "somewhere" "somehow" that's causing this BSOD.
o But what?

If this were a car and it were repetitively 'dying' out on the road
requiring all manner of inconvenience, one/some would take it to the
shop where it would go up on the rack to be diagnosed to be repaired if
possible.

Likewise, I think using it for your daily driver is a disadvantage in
the diagnosis business. The tweaked OS has two many unknowns.

For example, if you had some other machine you could be using for your
'daily activities', you could use one of the miniXP or mini10 or linux
continuously running some kind of benchmark as a 'stress' test for the
overall machine, so that the machine has the stress of both activity and
time with a known stable OS and no hdd. Then, if it crashed, you would
KNOW that you have a hardware problem of 'the worst kind' ie sporadic.

If it didn't crash, you would have eliminated any such hardware problem,
but you would still have two unknowns, the hdd and the Frankenholder
Win10, but that would be an improvement. I don't think your 'restore
point' approach is solving the Frankenholder w10 issue

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Mike Easter

[5 quoted lines suppressed]

If this were a car and it were repetitively 'dying' out on the road
requiring all manner of inconvenience, one/some would take it to the
shop where it would go up on the rack to be diagnosed to be repaired if
possible.
Likewise, I think using it for your daily driver is a disadvantage in
the diagnosis business. The tweaked OS has two many unknowns.
For example, if you had some other machine you could be using for your
'daily activities', you could use one of the miniXP or mini10 or linux
continuously running some kind of benchmark as a 'stress' test for the
overall machine, so that the machine has the stress of both activity and
time with a known stable OS and no hdd. Then, if it crashed, you would
KNOW that you have a hardware problem of 'the worst kind' ie sporadic.
If it didn't crash, you would have eliminated any such hardware problem,
but you would still have two unknowns, the hdd and the Frankenholder
Win10, but that would be an improvement. I don't think your 'restore
point' approach is solving the Frankenholder w10 issue

Hi Mike,

Here's an update, as I'm still running various diagnostic tools.
o I've dedicated an entire monitor just for 24/7 diagnostics.
<Loading Image...>

It hasn't BSOD'd in a few days, running 24/7, where I thought you'd be
interested in a "WhySoSlow" Analysis, after 24 hours of use as the dd:
o <Loading Image...>
o <Loading Image...>
o <Loading Image...>

The only anomaly I see is the mouse every once in a while is glitchy,
in that it doesn't move for a microsecond and then recovers, which happens
relatively frequently (about once an hour or so on average or so).

But I don't know of any tool, yet, that monitors mouse "glitchiness".
o Do you?

Here is the WhySoSlow analysis, after 24 hours of continuous use:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
OS version: Windows 10, 10.0, version 2004, build: 19041 (x64)
Hardware: NY549AA-ABA p6230y, HP-Pavilion, FOXCONN, ALOE
CPU: AuthenticAMD AMD Phenom(tm) II X4 810 Processor
Logical processors: 4
Processor groups: 1
RAM: 16127 MB total
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
CPU Speed
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your CPU speed ranged between 2594 Mhz and 2594 MHz.
The advertised clock speed of your processor is 2594 MHz.
Your main processor was running at its advertised clock speed only.
Your CPUs do not appear to be throttled down.
More info..<http://www.resplendence.com/whysoslow_help_cpuspeed>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
CPU Temperature
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your CPU temperature ranged between 36 °C and 39 °C
(equal to 96 °F - 102 °F) during the tests.
Your processors are running cool.
More info..<http://www.resplendence.com/whysoslow_help_cputemp>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
CPU Load
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
While the test was idle, your CPU usage ranged from 18.7% to 60.8%.
Your processor's resources do not appear to be used heavily.
More info..<http://www.resplendence.com/whysoslow_help_cpuload>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Memory Load
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The amount of RAM used by your system while the test was running ranged
from 19.7% to 20.1%.
More info..<http://www.resplendence.com/whysoslow_help_memload>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Paging Information
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
During the test hard pagefaults ranged from 0.0 to 9.1 pagefaults per second.
The values reported are considered excellent.
More info..<http://www.resplendence.com/whysoslow_help_hardpagefaults>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Application responsiveness
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The highest application responsiveness on your system was measured at 0.140 ms.
This value is considered good.
Your system appears to be responsive.
More info..<http://www.resplendence.com/whysoslow_help_appresponsiveness>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kernel latencies and real-time capabilities
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The highest kernel responsiveness on your system was measured at 0.136 ms.
This value is considered good.
There do not appear to be drivers causing your system to be unsuitable
for real-time processing capabilities.
More info..<http://www.resplendence.com/whysoslow_help_kernelresponsiveness>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BIOS and chipset behavior
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The highest measured SM BIOS interrupt or other stall was 1 microseconds.
This value is considered excellent.
No problems have been detected during the tests.
More info..<http://www.resplendence.com/whysoslow_help_smm>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Conclusion
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your system has been analyzed. Your system appears to be running fine.
No problems were found.
Report generated on 9/21/2020 2:22:22

[wasbit]

Post by Arlen Holder

Post by Mike Easter

[5 quoted lines suppressed]

If this were a car and it were repetitively 'dying' out on the road
requiring all manner of inconvenience, one/some would take it to the
shop where it would go up on the rack to be diagnosed to be repaired if
possible.
Likewise, I think using it for your daily driver is a disadvantage in
the diagnosis business. The tweaked OS has two many unknowns.
For example, if you had some other machine you could be using for your
'daily activities', you could use one of the miniXP or mini10 or linux
continuously running some kind of benchmark as a 'stress' test for the
overall machine, so that the machine has the stress of both activity and
time with a known stable OS and no hdd. Then, if it crashed, you would
KNOW that you have a hardware problem of 'the worst kind' ie sporadic.
If it didn't crash, you would have eliminated any such hardware problem,
but you would still have two unknowns, the hdd and the Frankenholder
Win10, but that would be an improvement. I don't think your 'restore
point' approach is solving the Frankenholder w10 issue

Hi Mike,
Here's an update, as I'm still running various diagnostic tools.
o I've dedicated an entire monitor just for 24/7 diagnostics.

It's not a monitor you need to dedicate.
Until you have installed a pristine OS & let it run without changes you are
not going to discern whether the problem is software or hardware.
As I suggested previously, use a spare hard drive, with a generic
installation key if required, & remove the power from the original drive.

[Arlen Holder]

Post by wasbit
Until you have installed a pristine OS & let it run without changes you are
not going to discern whether the problem is software or hardware.

Hi wasbit,

Thanks for your purposefully helpful advice, which I don't necessarily
disagree with on principle.

Certainly I agree that it would be far _simpler_ (i.e., fewer variables) if
I set up a separate HDD with a fresh Windows 10, and just let it run.

That's actually not too hard to do at all (if inconvenient); that plan
simply requires a spare HDD and another desktop as my daily drive, both of
which I can manage (by shuffling things around a bit), so that I can
dedicate the "bad" machine to a full-time diagnostic test for a few weeks.

That's the "hard" plan.

Post by wasbit
As I suggested previously, use a spare hard drive, with a generic
installation key if required, & remove the power from the original drive.

I'm not sure what you mean by a "generic installation key" since Microsoft
will activate Windows 10 as long as I don't change too much, where the HDD
isn't too much in my experience, so it should be fine with the current key.

My assumption is that it's either drivers (which all tested good) or
hardware (which also all tested good), as they're the major culprits.

It's my understanding that malware "could" also do it, but for what gain,
and, besides, MalwareBytes and Windows Defender haven't complained (not
that that means all that much - but I have no reason to suspect software).

It could be my hundreds of tweaks to Windows of course, but seriously, none
of them are "special" in that all are published (which is how I find them).

Right now, I'm sticking with the original plan, which is what anyone
"should" do if they encounter a BSOD, which is simply to "debug" it.

I should be getting crash logs this time (it's not intuitive how to set
that up properly), so the many crash-log detection utilities I've installed
will hopefully earn their position on my HDD when I do get the next BSOD.

That's currently my "easy" plan:
a. Continue monitoring the system hardware
b. Continue using the system as the daily drive
c. Wait for a crash and then pounce on the crash logs

I'm excited in a hopeful way to see what's inside those crash logs.
o Until then, one by one, I'm running down your stress-test software list!

o Benchmark/Stress Test Freeware, by wasbit
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.freeware/ZIA12GCPuSg>

[Flasherly]

Post by Mike Easter
- almost as a red herring we discuss POSTing issues
- those two *different* issues overlap/confusion should be eliminated

HIRENS versions just mentioned in the context of freeware, I was able
to collect all the HIRENS versions. Some or both are on a USB, to
include a CD boot viz a BIOS override, but more importantly is that
different HIRENS versions potentially may interact differently to
different hardware platforms they're accordingly subjected. Some of
things I do, laying in boot arbitrators over the MBR, may require some
careful and consecutively planning, staged as it were off a pivotal
Boot Arbitrator, which can also be on several drives, although for all
intents is valid only for the drive the BIOS is pointing at for a boot
sequence.

Anyway, the latest HIRENS may not exactly "cut it" depending on the
platform and manipulations intended. Nor will USB always be
indicated: There are instances where a CD boot, into HIRENS, is the
indicated course.

As Prior HIRENS Versions still Freeware for available download, I
might add (I consider, anyway, better with than w/out).

[Flasherly]

Post by Flasherly
CD boot, into HIRENS

The Gods permitting my two post-PATA SATA CD unit interfaces, often
now in idle disuse, unlike possibly PATA on a storage/junk shelf, with
lenses crusted over, motors and linkages gummed, firmware optical
identity issues between Pacific Rim disc plant distributions, and, not
least, the Devil take newer USB plug-in drive units straight to Hell.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Flasherly

Post by Mike Easter
- almost as a red herring we discuss POSTing issues
- those two *different* issues overlap/confusion should be eliminated

different HIRENS versions potentially may interact differently to
different hardware platforms they're accordingly subjected.
Anyway, the latest HIRENS may not exactly "cut it" depending on the
platform and manipulations intended.

In earlier Hirens versions, there are more instances of tool selection
in which copyright issues were 'fuzzier' viz freeware vs shareware vs
payware. More recent Hirens are cleaner, but some of the old payware
apps which were included earlier are useful. Some H versions
'delineate' which softwares are which (F/S/P) and leave it up to the
user to respect the rights or not.

Post by Flasherly
Nor will USB always be indicated: There are instances where a CD
boot, into HIRENS, is the indicated course.

I don't see how it would make any diff whether it was booted from USB or
optical.

Post by Flasherly
As Prior HIRENS Versions still Freeware for available download, I
might add (I consider, anyway, better with than w/out).

[Flasherly]

Post by Mike Easter
I don't see how it would make any diff whether it was booted from USB or
optical.

OK. Well, then, I can straighten that out real quick. I've some sort
of Pentium I put behind the storage shelves of earlier hardware, only
a bonefide Packrat from Hell could keep around, alternatively and
quite possibly, a decent and suitable AM3 socket with a 2GHz CPU
iteration. The objective will be to place, on an active HDD
partition, (SSD for Extra Credit), with both a DOS Sys Drive command
the included DOS paired-version that is to be found on HIRENS;- upon
completion and also included, on HIRENS, where a Boot Arbitrator will
be found, whereby the DOS OS may be operably achieved, additionally of
course along with whatever else optionally goes on three potential,
active partitions, and respective operating system, possible from one
HDD and only one possible by default for a BIOS indicator boot.

All you'll have at your disposal, within resources limited by and from
three earlier versions of HIRENS, to include, illustratively, the
valid option (no older hardware than both capable) to boot both,
either from CD optical, or a USB flashstick device.

All that's left, if you decide to accept the mission statement, is to
send me a big fat check to mail you my old Pentium or AMD. (:))

-
P.S. If I'm not dreaming, mistaken, voided, there's a GHOST around
thereabouts, somewhere, for running on top of DOS to image the
consecutive, up and unto three legal active partitions, as
sector-dependent binary rewrites,- a deucedly good argument for
shared resources: placed outside on reserved logical partitions.

-
Sam Flynn: What am I supposed to do?
Gem: Survive.
-Tron (Legacy)

[Mike Easter]

I only understand parts of this; not the full picture.

Post by Flasherly

Post by Mike Easter
I don't see how it would make any diff whether it was booted from USB or
optical.

The objective will be to place, on an active HDD
partition, (SSD for Extra Credit), with both a DOS Sys Drive command
the included DOS paired-version that is to be found on HIRENS;

I understand the concept of the DOS sys command.

Post by Flasherly
HIRENS, where a Boot Arbitrator will be found, whereby the DOS OS may
be operably achieved,

I interpret your 'boot arbitrator' as the H menu which provides the
options to boot into miniXP, the old 2012 linux Parted Magic, DOS, and
some others including the Plop or Smart boot managers. Others include
the ability to clear/change older Win passwords up to 7, Darik's boot &
nuke, etc. As opposed to boot arbitrator = boot manager (another
possible interpretation).

Post by Flasherly
additionally of course along with whatever else optionally goes on
three potential, active partitions, and respective operating system,
possible from one HDD and only one possible by default for a BIOS
indicator boot.

That collection of words and phrases escapes me.

Post by Flasherly
All you'll have at your disposal, within resources limited by and from
three earlier versions of HIRENS, to include, illustratively, the
valid option (no older hardware than both capable) to boot both,
either from CD optical, or a USB flashstick device.

I believe that is a description of the contest/puzzle that the
contestant may use or compare the ability to do the task which I don't
really understand yet, from either booting the H from optical or USB.

The structure of a USB which has been configured to take an .iso 9660
optical 'file' and configure it to boot as a hdd is NOT the same as the
structure of an optical to which the same .iso 9660 optical file has
been burned.

So... in the simplistic environment of DOS, which is not at all as
powerful as the linux shell, the nature of how to 'adjust' the sys
command to be able to scoot the DOS sys over to something else might not
be practical. I assume I would be able to do it from a floppy; I also
think I could write a DOS sys to some hdd part/s with some other tools;
I just don't know if I could do it from the Hirens.

Post by Flasherly
-
P.S. If I'm not dreaming, mistaken, voided, there's a GHOST around
thereabouts, somewhere, for running on top of DOS to image the
consecutive, up and unto three legal active partitions, as
sector-dependent binary rewrites,- a deucedly good argument for
shared resources: placed outside on reserved logical partitions.

I know of a free linux program called G4L (Ghost for Linux) which is
like Norton Ghost.

There is also a linux distro called Clonezilla which is reputed to be
like Norton Ghost as a partition and disk cloning distro.

[Flasherly]

On Sun, 13 Sep 2020 18:45:08 -0700, Mike Easter <***@ster.invalid>
wrote:

* Full Picture I've included at the end of this file.
Ghost, Smart Boot Manager, and DOS _is on there_ if not another
version, although apparently DOS is not listed, at least as I made or
copied this listing included for later (probably at one point from
HIRENS website).

No H option. HIRENS is removed -- after the HDD is actively
partitoned, that DOS is established for an initial operating with
Format /S or the Dos SYS command, e.g. as _derived_ solely from
HIRENS.

That is the correct interpretation you've given of a Boot Arbitrator,
Boot Manager, i.e. as same category/class to UNIX GRUB (included on
Win7 possibly W10), just that I particularly like Smart Boot Manager
(listed below, and among the several others as well available, whether
opened-sourced and variously then freeware).

Up to now, that is and so far, in getting back to making one active
partition, which can optionally be added Smart Boot Manager (and
possibly more operating systems, although there can be three more
natively set: A HDD, BIOS/CMOS, a computer, Natively, can have no more
than four operating systems on no more than four active partitions. (I
haven't run every Boot Arbitrator out there to say where rule of four
active partitions can be exceeded.) And, of course, for the BIOS to
boot from -- defined and set as the primary boot device, among one or
more HDDs, as the BIOS first preference if and before defaulting to
another -- secondary, tertiary, and quaternary boot preference
devices, et al.

The context puzzle thing is what I've run into, from one HIRENS
Version issue to another HIRENS Version, in getting to a DOS-level:
That would be from HIRENS "Boot to DOS" or however worded (where at:
the DOS menu is with a couple EMS related memory options -and-
importantly HIRENS support for a CD). Once there, HIRENS does its DOS
creation thing to dump itself into DOS, as in period and Your Out
(takes a reboot to reinitiate HIRENS). From HIRENS, to continue,
HIRENS does that, no less, on a Virtual RamDrive of HIRENS making. OK,
then. This is the point point -within DOS-, anyway, that the Format
/S(ystem) or Sys [drive] command[.com] is engaged, transfering system
files HIRENs makes available initially to a store-bought physical
HDD/SSD installed but not yet bootable.

No Linux, no Windows, no nothing. Everything is HIRENS and all for
that one DOS partition. (And no goddamn Floppy, either.-) The DOS
transfer to HDD IS and CAN be done from HIRENS ONLY, nothing else.
The whole point is I need the older HIRENs to do it, make myself a
DOS-able guy, on -some- systems. FDisk/ Sys, HIRENS places on a
RamDrive, that May Not be achievable from a USB virtual Flashstick,
with the DOS options, again, for CD support. HIRENS' generic
interface drivers, there's three or four that HIRENS "attempts" to
load from, for a valid CD to BIOS identity, in case of a Fault and
Fail.

Whereupon I insert another but Earlier HIRENS version, I put
conversely on a CD image, reboot from that CD, go to HIRENS DOS menu
and activate CD support, whereupon it successfully takes without an
error, so then -- I'm dumped off HIRENs at that point with a Valid
RamDrive containing the DOS files needed to make a bootable HDD from
Fdisk or Sys commands. And that's the End of my Case Story: Every
computer, so far at least, I've managed to get this far to a valid DOS
transfer.

Ghost for Linux, G4L. That's a cool thing, for sure. I can remember
before binary transfers. The world was living, at the time, in the
Dark Ages. Everybody had a button on the back of their jeans that
came undone, flopped down and, boom, instant Ass Exposure. That would
be Windows 95, actually, No Cloning, and a back-up meant mostly
floppies and tapes. I actually had to buy (unbeknownst) a POS
Motherboard, which offered a "Free Peter Norton Ghost" as an purchase
incentive. What did I learn -- Never Ever buy another BioStar
Motherboard. The Ghost has saved my butt plenty, though.

Desert time. Here's the pudding:


* Full Picuture:
Hiren's BootCD 7.3 (as I said one of other verions among a few at
least variously on both on Flashstick and CDs)

Partition Tools

Partition Magic Pro 8.05 Best software to partition hard drive

Paragon Partition Manager 6.1.571 Universal tool for partitions

Partition Commander 8.01 partition your hard drive,with undo feature

Ranish Partition Manager 2.44 a boot manager and hard disk
partitioner.

The Partition Resizer v1.3.4 move and resize partitions in 1step
+more.

Smart Fdisk 2.05 a simple harddisk partition manager

SPecial Fdisk SPFDISK a partition tool.

eXtended Fdisk XFDISK allows easy partition creation and edition

Disk Clone Tools

ImageCenter 5.6 (Drive Image 2002) Best software to clone hard drive

Norton Ghost 8.2 Similar to Drive Image (with usb/scsi support)

Partition Saver 2.80 A tool to backup/restore partitions.


Antivirus Tools

F-Prot Antivirus 3.16b virus scanner (with ntfs support and easy to
use menu)

McAfee Antivirus 4.40 a virus scanner (with ntfs support and easy to
use menu)

Recovery Tools

Active Partition Recovery 3.0 To Recover a Deleted partition.

Active Uneraser 3.0 recover deleted files and folders on FAT and NTFS
systems.

Ontrack Easy Recovery Pro 6.04 Recover data deleted by virus attack

Winternals Disk Commander 1.1 more than standard deleted-file recovery
utility

TestDisk 5.8 Tool to check and undelete partition.

Lost & Found 1.06 a good old data recovery software.

DiyDataRecovery Diskpatch 2.1.100 An excellent data recovery software.

Prosoft Media Tools 5.0 v1.1.2.64 data recovery software many options.

Testing Tools

System Speed Test 4.78 tests CPU, harddrive, ect.

PC-Check 5.50 Easy to use hardware tests

Ontrack Data Advisor 5.0 diagnostic for condition of computer

The Troubleshooter 7.02 all kind of hardware testing tool

PC Doctor 3.0 a benchmarking and information tool

Test Cpu/Video/Disk 5.6 a tool to test cpu, video, and disk

RAM (Memory) Testing Tools

DocMemory 2.2b RAM Test utility

GoldMemory 6.64 RAM Test utility

Memtest86+ 1.55 PC Memory Test

Hard Disk Tools

Hard Disk Diagnostic Utilities
Seagate Seatools Desktop Edition 3.02
Western Digital Data Lifeguard Tools
Western Digital Diagnostics (DLGDIAG) 5.04c
Maxtor PowerMax 4.21
Maxtor amset utility 4.0
Maxtor(or any Hdd) Low Level Formatter 1.1
Fujitsu HDD Diagnostic Tool 6.30
Fujitsu IDE Low Level Format 1.0
Samsung HDD Utility(HUTIL) 1.25
Samsung Disk Diagnose (SHDIAG) 1.25
IBM/Hitachi Drive Fitness Test 4.04
IBM/Hitachi Feature Tool 1.80
Gateway GwScan 3.15
MHDD 4.5

HDD Regenerator 1.51 to recover a bad hard drive

Ontrack Disk Manager 9.57 Disk Test/Format/Maintenance tool.

Norton Disk Doctor 2002 repair damaged disk, or diagnose hard drive.

Norton Disk Editor 2002 disk editing, manual data recovery tool.

Active Kill Disk 1.1 Securely destroys all data on physical drive.

SmartUDM 2.00 Hard Disk Drive S.M.A.R.T. Viewer.

System Information Tools

Aida16 2.12 system information tool, details of all components of the
PC

PCI and AGP info Tool The PCI System information & Exploration tool.

System Analyser version 5.3h View extensive information about hardware

Navr til Software System Information 0.58.6 High-end system
information tool

Astra 5.1 Advanced System info Tool and Reporting Assistant

HwInfo 4.96 a powerful system information utility

PC-Config 9.33 Complete hardware detection of your computer

SysChk 2.46 Find out exactly what is under the hood of your PC

CPU Identification utility v1.8 Detailed information on CPU

CTIA CPU Information another CPU information tool

MBR (Master Boot Record) Tools

MBR Work 1.07b a utility to perform some common and uncommon MBR
functions

MBR Tool 2.1.100 backup, verify, restore, edit, remove, display,
re-write...

DiskMan4 all in one tool for cmos, bios, bootrecord and more

BootFix Utility Run this utility if you get 'Invalid system disk'

MBR SAVE / RESTORE 2.1 BootSave and BootRest tools to save / restore
MBR

Boot Partition 2.50 add Partition in the Windows NT/2000/XP Multi-boot
loader

Partition Table Doctor 3.0 tool to repair/modify mbr, bootsector,
partition

Smart Boot Manager 3.7.1 a multi boot manager

Bootmagic 8.0 This tool is for multi boot operating systems

BIOS / CMOS Tools

CMOS 0.93 CMOS Save / Restore Tool

BIOS Cracker 4.6 BIOS password remover (cmospwd)

BIOS Cracker 1.4 BIOS password remover (cmospwc)

BIOS Utility 1.35.0 BIOS Informations, password, beep codes and more.

!BIOS 3.20 a powerfull utility for bios and cmos

DISKMAN4 a powerful all in one utility

UniFlash 1.40 bios flash utility

Kill CMOS a tiny utility to wipe cmos

MultiMedia Tools

Picture Viewer 1.94 Picture viewer for dos, supports more then 40
filetypes.

QuickView Pro 2.54 movie viewer for dos, supports many format
including divx.

MpxPlay 1.15 a small Music Player for dos

Password Tools

Active Password Changer 2.1 Reset User Password on NT/2000/XP/2003
(FAT/NTFS)

Offline NT/2K/XP Password Changer reset nt/2000/xp administrator/user
password.

NTPWD utility to reset windows nt/2000/xp administrator/user password.

NTFS Tools

NTFS Dos Pro 5.0 To access ntfs partitions from Dos

NTFS 4 Dos 1.4 To access ntfs partitions from Dos

NTFS Dos 3.02 To access ntfs partitions from Dos

EditBINI 1.01 to Edit boot.ini on NTFS Partition

Dos File Managers

Volkov Commander 4.99 Dos File Manager with LongFileName/ntfs support

Dos Command Center 5.1 Classic dos-based file manager.

File Wizard 1.35 file manager - colored, drag and drop copy, move,
delete etc.

File Maven 3.5 Dos file manager PC-to-PC file trx via serial or
parallel cable

FastLynx 2.0 Dos file manager with Pc to Pc file transfer capability

LapLink 5.0 the smart way to transfer files and directories between
PCs.

Mini Windows 3.11 Back to old days, use it as a file manager

Mini Windows 98 run Hard Drive/ Ram Drive, 7-Zip Defragmenter Image
Viewer, .


Other Tools

DosCDroast beta 2 Dos CD Burning Tools

Universal TCP/IP Network 5.4 MSDOS Network Client via TCP/IP to MS
based

Dos Tools

USB CD-Rom Driver 1 Standard usb_cd.sys driver for cd drive

Universal USB Driver 2 Panasonic v2.20 ASPI Manager for USB mass
storage

Interlnk support at COM1 To access another computer from COM port

Interlnk support at LPT1 To access another computer from LPT port

dos utilities

extract.exe pkzip.exe pkunzip.exe unrar.exe rar.exe
ace.exe lha.exe gzip.exe uharcd.exe mouse.com
attrib.com deltree.exe xcopy.exe diskcopy.com imgExtrc.exe
undelete.com edit.com fdisk.exe fdisk2.exe fdisk3.exe
lf.exe delpart.exe wipe.com zap.com format.com
move.exe more.com find.exe hex.exe debug.exe
split.exe mem.exe mi.com sys.com smartdrv.exe
xmsdsk.exe killer.exe share.exe scandisk.exe scanreg.exe
guest.exe doskey.exe duse.exe biosdtct.exe setver.exe
ntersvr.exe interlnk.exe loadlin.exe lfndos.exe doslfn.com

Windows Tools

SpaceMonger 1.4 keeping track of the free space on your computer

Drive Temperature 1.0 Hard Disk Drive temperature meter

Disk Speed1.0 Hard Disk Drive Speed Testing Tool

MemTest 1.0 a Memory Testing Tool

PageDfrg 2.3 System file Defragmenter For NT/2k/XP

Split Join 1.3.3 a Small File Split-Join Tool

Ghost Image Explorer 7.0 to add/remove/extract files from Ghost image
file

DriveImage Explorer 5.0 to add/remove/extract files from Drive image
file

Active Undelete 5.0 a tool to recover deleted files

Restoration 2.5.14 a tool to recover deleted files

Startup Control Panel 2.8 a tool to edit startup programs

Startup Monitor 1.02 tool detect program registers itself to run at
sys startup

IB Process Manager 1.02 a little process manager for 9x/2k, shows dll
info etc.

HijackThis 1.99 a general homepage hijackers detector and remover and
more

TCPView 2.40 a detailed listings of all TCP and UDP endpoints

Unknown Devices 1.2 find unknown devices in Device Manager really are

PCI 32 Sniffer 1.1 device information tool (similar to unknown
devices)

Ad-Aware SE Personal 1.06 remove spyware, adware, dialers etc. (must
have tool)

Hiren's BootCD 7.3
http://thanki.tk mirror
http://thanki.cjb.net

[Flasherly]

On Mon, 14 Sep 2020 01:09:39 -0400, Flasherly <***@live.com>
wrote:

Being dumped from HIRENs upon a DOS boot with Virtual RamDrive, I
should add, the HIRENS CD/ISO is still accessibly readable, but the
HIRENS menu is no longer available, along with many programs under
those menu items, for running purposes, until a reboot.

They can be "looked at" from a DOS environment though, for whether
which of the executables may still be run apart from an initial HIRENS
dependency.

I'll include a listing of what's on the DOS RamDrive HIRENS "dumps"
itself into after successfully selecting the DOS HIRENS activation
screen (with CD support). And a little more about Smart Boot Manger,
aside. Hopefully, that should be just HIRENS com/exe and such items,
and nothing I personally thought to throw along into the mix.

Sys.exe, Fdisk, Format.exe, Sys.com, and Command.com, are all
included, so main goal and the DOS system files transfer is from the
quasi-DOS Ramdrive to a HDD partition: Sys [Ramdrive letter]
[Harddrive letter].

I've had trouble with a SSD and drive geometry from various different
partitioning software, whereupon running Smart Boot Manager indicated
itself installed but renders the HDD not bootable. Only in case with
a 256G Crucial SSD and after using several partitioners, when, it so
happened, Partition Magic made a DOS partition that did take a
subsequent valid BIOS boot for Smart Boot Manager. Also so happening,
I've a early Samsung 128G EVO that I've no issues with, that the
Samsung as greater and wide compatibility for Smart Boot Manager and
partitioning software, than the Crucial. I may have better off to have
kept that EVO for a primary boot device arbitrator, using the Crucial
for dedicating it to another OS, as I did instead and unfortunately
with the EVO.

The CD, system level drivers HIRENS using to load DOS, I also see are
apparently included. As apparently DOS dated, at least with this
HIRENS version, I copied to HDD upon a time of when using HIRENS, in
viewing Command.com, that it's MS-Dos 7.1 (perhaps a Windows 98, late
SE, early XP command.com). . .

Fdisk3 views for MS-DOS and 1998.
Format " " MS-DOS and 1995 Ver 7
Sys.com " " MS-DOS " "

-& et. al.

Smart Boot Manager 3.7.1 Installer Copyright (C) 2000 Suzhe, Lonius
This is free software, you can redistribute it and/or modify it
under the terms of the GNU General Public License version 2.

HIRENS\RAMDRV

08/10/2001 02:00 AM 456,714 ACE.EXE
01/21/2002 05:51 PM 256 ACE.KEY
10/31/2003 12:28 AM 256,180 ARJ.EXE
09/13/2000 06:25 PM 24,352 ATAPICD.SYS
06/30/2003 07:10 PM 5,044 ATTRIB.COM
05/05/1999 10:22 PM 5,335 CHOICE.COM
05/05/2003 10:22 PM 94,292 COMMAND.COM
03/28/2001 10:34 PM 20,125 CWSDPMI.EXE
05/06/1998 08:01 PM 20,554 DEBUG.EXE
08/23/2005 07:07 PM 2,271 DEFAULT.PCM
02/03/2004 11:44 PM 58,139 DELPART.EXE
04/23/1999 10:22 PM 19,083 DELTREE.EXE
04/27/2004 09:28 PM 19,238 DI.COM
04/23/1999 10:22 PM 21,975 DISKCOPY.COM
10/22/2003 10:10 AM 5,618 DOSKEY.COM
03/01/2005 10:47 PM 18,849 DOSLFN.COM
12/20/2003 11:57 PM 69,902 EDIT.COM
10/13/2002 11:06 AM 1,283 EDITBINI.TXT
10/24/1999 02:09 AM 10,244 EFDISK.EXE
07/11/2003 10:09 AM 2,982 ENUFDISC.EXE
12/20/2003 11:57 PM 49,094 EXTRACT.EXE
04/06/2003 10:29 PM 35,880 FDISK.EXE
11/30/2002 12:14 PM 8,447 FDISK.INI
03/30/2001 02:38 PM 22,827 FDISK2.EXE
05/18/2000 08:35 AM 64,460 FDISK3.EXE
07/23/2002 10:04 PM 21,232 FDISKPT.INI
05/30/2003 10:57 AM 4,870 FIND.COM
12/20/2003 11:57 PM 8,009 FINDCD.EXE
04/23/1999 10:22 PM 49,575 FORMAT.COM
12/20/2003 11:57 PM 5,964 GET.EXE
07/26/2005 07:21 PM 803 GETDEF.DAT
12/19/2003 12:57 AM 16,331 GUEST.EXE
08/19/1993 05:53 PM 39,910 GZIP.EXE
04/13/1995 12:05 AM 1,921 HEX.CFG
04/17/1995 12:41 AM 50,502 HEX.EXE
04/23/1999 10:22 PM 3,708 IFSHLP.SYS
08/19/1996 02:10 AM 40,960 IMGEXTRC.EXE
02/11/2003 10:00 AM 7,375 KEYB.EXE
07/07/2003 07:19 PM 12 KILLCMOS.COM
09/06/1995 08:03 PM 2,435 KILLER.EXE
04/26/2000 11:56 AM 39,848 LF.EXE
08/29/1999 02:03 AM 40,910 LFNDOS.EXE
01/10/1996 12:00 AM 36,624 LHA.EXE
12/04/2002 05:08 PM 2,677 LMOD.COM
02/16/1995 09:12 AM 66,032 LOADSYS.EXE
12/20/2003 11:57 PM 32,146 MEM.EXE
05/26/2000 08:20 AM 8,492 MI.COM
12/20/2003 11:57 PM 14,158 MODE.COM
12/20/2003 11:57 PM 8,388 MORE.COM
12/20/2003 11:57 PM 4,848 MOUSE.COM
04/23/1999 10:22 PM 27,299 MOVE.EXE
12/20/2003 11:57 PM 41,302 OAKCDROM.SYS
07/20/2005 05:30 PM 445 PCMENU.BAT
07/22/1990 01:30 AM 7,588 PCMS.COM
03/01/1999 02:50 AM 34,583 PKUNZIP.EXE
03/01/1999 02:50 AM 50,663 PKZIP.EXE
06/09/2003 10:12 PM 8,926 PKZIPFIX.EXE
06/11/2003 01:02 AM 361 RAR.CFG
03/24/1999 05:41 PM 105,208 RAR.EXE
12/20/2003 11:57 PM 427 REBOOT.COM
07/30/2003 04:16 PM 9,146 RECOVER.EXE
05/06/1998 08:01 PM 143,818 SCANDISK.EXE
04/23/1999 10:22 PM 165,502 SCANREG.EXE
04/23/1999 10:22 PM 18,939 SETVER.EXE
12/14/2003 02:11 PM 4,554 SHARE.EXE
05/30/2005 12:18 PM 7,873 SHSUCDX.COM
03/10/2001 04:34 PM 451 SHUTDOWN.COM
07/17/2005 05:55 PM 45,379 SMARTDRV.EXE
04/29/2001 09:17 AM 11,260 SPLIT.EXE
07/10/2003 09:59 PM 3,758 STOW.EXE
04/23/1999 05:22 PM 18,967 SYS.COM
08/25/2005 09:44 PM 124,544 UHARCD.EXE
12/26/2001 12:00 AM 5,788 UNDELETE.COM
12/26/2001 12:00 AM 5,768 UNDELETE.TXT
03/02/1999 06:13 AM 32,086 UNRAR.EXE
08/25/2005 09:44 PM 316,311 USB_ASPI.CAB
02/17/1998 11:28 AM 11,188 VIDE-CDD.SYS
06/08/2005 02:55 PM 47 W.BAT
04/29/2005 09:32 AM 11,545 WBAT.COM
06/28/2005 12:30 PM 2,253 WBAT.INI
05/01/2004 01:33 PM 2,219 WIPE.COM
02/05/2003 05:00 PM 16,442 XCOPY.EXE
10/28/2005 08:51 AM 6,262 Z.BAT
05/01/2004 01:33 PM 1,831 ZAP.COM

[Mike Easter]

Post by Flasherly
Being dumped from HIRENs upon a DOS boot with Virtual RamDrive, I
should add, the HIRENS CD/ISO is still accessibly readable, but the
HIRENS menu is no longer available, along with many programs under
those menu items, for running purposes, until a reboot.

I abbreviate Hirens w/ H

When H 15.2 is booted from USB, its initial screen is a grub4dos* (a
grub fork now defunct but useful for H purposes). It has 2 different
ways to get into DOS, one on the first screen (item #3) and one on a
later screen accessed w/ the 'more' item, last. On the first more
screen is Dos programs alternate boot method (using memdisk).
Navigating in the dos selection allows one to set up the environment for
the dos, such as the size of a ram disk and other settings. H also
provides an 'escape hatch' from many of its modes (but not all) which
takes you back to the original grub4dos menu/s.


* http://microsaint.narod.ru/_Info_Grub4Dos/Grub4dos_tutorial.html
Grub4dos tutorial

[Flasherly]

Post by Mike Easter
I abbreviate Hirens w/ H
When H 15.2 is booted from USB, its initial screen is a grub4dos* (a
grub fork now defunct but useful for H purposes). It has 2 different
ways to get into DOS, one on the first screen (item #3) and one on a
later screen accessed w/ the 'more' item, last. On the first more
screen is Dos programs alternate boot method (using memdisk).
Navigating in the dos selection allows one to set up the environment for
the dos, such as the size of a ram disk and other settings. H also
provides an 'escape hatch' from many of its modes (but not all) which
takes you back to the original grub4dos menu/s.
* http://microsaint.narod.ru/_Info_Grub4Dos/Grub4dos_tutorial.html
Grub4dos tutorial

The GRUB is later and I also have and got into a later version(s), but
still had to go back for an earlier version, eventually an earlier ISO
on CD to lay in a small DOS-bootable HDD partition, FAT16, where I'll
access Ghost.exe from other drives. I had issues with the later
HIRENS DOS CD drivers, from a USB HIRENS boot, an earlier HIRENS ISO
CD image solved for what I was doing - making a DOS bootable SSD
partition..

[Mike Easter]

Post by Flasherly
I had issues with the later
HIRENS DOS CD drivers, from a USB HIRENS boot, an earlier HIRENS ISO
CD image solved for what I was doing - making a DOS bootable SSD
partition..

There are 48 different v/s of Hirens available from the site, from 5.0
to 15.2; there has been a LOT of evolution over those years.

[Flasherly]

Post by Mike Easter
There are 48 different v/s of Hirens available from the site, from 5.0
to 15.2; there has been a LOT of evolution over those years.

Here should have three, I doubt four versions, in my CD folder. I had
no idea. If as you say literally available (for downloading) is
interesting. Some utilities to be found are plainly outdated, other
outdated to the point that they can be destructive if wrongly applied.
But at times going through them is neither futile gesture, not if
something worthwhile for applicability turns up. Not least the latest
releases.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Flasherly

Post by Mike Easter
There are 48 different v/s of Hirens available from the site, from 5.0
to 15.2; there has been a LOT of evolution over those years.

If as you say literally available (for downloading) is
interesting.

Go to this page which default is for 15.2

https://www.hirensbootcd.org/old-versions/

In the upper R but below the search function is a menu function which
goes all the way back to 5. The last 4 are 14.1, 15.0, 15.1, and 15.2.

Since each menu function opens a detailed list of all of the contents
organized by function and name, version, function, status as to
win/linux/dos free/share, one can find which particular 2 or 3 choices
would give them the 'range' of apps they want.

There is only one H PE; the last H CD-type 15.2 is 2012.

[Flasherly]

Post by Mike Easter
There is only one H PE; the last H CD-type 15.2 is 2012.

My CD ISOs are older versions, but being that's 2012, it's probably
what I've loaded (with Rufus or like) to a multi-boot FlashStick. I'd
also have to question the version naming conventions, since the site
list ends in its earliest release of 5.0, and I've marked my CDs, for
some peculiar reason, with version below that.

[Flasherly]

Post by Mike Easter
There is only one H PE; the last H CD-type 15.2 is 2012.

My CD ISOs are older versions, but being that's 2012, it's probably
what I've loaded (with Rufus or like) to a multi-boot FlashStick. I'd
also have to question the version naming conventions, since the site
list ends in its earliest release of 5.0, and I've marked my CDs, for
some peculiar reason, with version below that.

[Flasherly]

Post by Mike Easter
There is only one H PE; the last H CD-type 15.2 is 2012.

My CD ISOs are older versions, but being that's 2012, it's probably
what I've loaded (with Rufus or like) to a multi-boot FlashStick. I'd
also have to question the version naming conventions, since the site
list ends in its earliest release of 5.0, and I've marked my CDs, for
some peculiar reason, with version below that.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Flasherly

Post by Mike Easter
There is only one H PE; the last H CD-type 15.2 is 2012.

My CD ISOs are older versions, but being that's 2012, it's probably
what I've loaded (with Rufus or like) to a multi-boot FlashStick. I'd
also have to question the version naming conventions, since the site
list ends in its earliest release of 5.0, and I've marked my CDs, for
some peculiar reason, with version below that.

On my Yumi multiboot menu, I can see the H version # before it boots;
then I can see it again at the top of the grub4dos screen which grub4dos
name has its v. 0.4.5c20121002.

[Flasherly]

Post by Mike Easter
On my Yumi multiboot menu, I can see the H version # before it boots;
then I can see it again at the top of the grub4dos screen which grub4dos
name has its v. 0.4.5c20121002.

Possibly I'd lazily either kept, so-named as someone gave me a HIRENS
disc, or as much omitted the decimal designator one, that in
likelihood my CD disk 4.5 is really 14.6.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Flasherly

Post by Mike Easter
On my Yumi multiboot menu, I can see the H version # before it boots;
then I can see it again at the top of the grub4dos screen which grub4dos
name has its v. 0.4.5c20121002.

Possibly I'd lazily either kept, so-named as someone gave me a HIRENS
disc, or as much omitted the decimal designator one, that in
likelihood my CD disk 4.5 is really 14.6.

I think I would look at the grub4dos screen for the version of Hiren.
The site doesn't currently offer anything between 14.1 and 15.0.

[Flasherly]

Post by Mike Easter
I think I would look at the grub4dos screen for the version of Hiren.
The site doesn't currently offer anything between 14.1 and 15.0.

I do recall my earlier HIRENS versions don't use Grub4Dos, which in
the latter is distinctive and altogether a different interface with
operability characteristics. Then again, I neither can say what in
fact would power the menu behind earlier, presumably apart from Grub
versions altogether.

14.1 and 15.0 sounds thick, as possibly to do with abandonware and
who's picking up what for controlling rights and purposes, from
earlier HIRENs at the time and what all then they contained which
subsequently the author decided to omit.

I'm really not sure quite what I have now after looking at the site
listing, conclusively if I'm exceeding 14.1 by earlier and now
unavailable issues. Besides Ghost as I said I do have, there's also
Partition Magic, along with whateverelse of rummageable interest turns
up.

[Flasherly]

Post by Flasherly
making a DOS bootable SSD
partition..

And once there, seems Smart Boot Manager might not have been on the
later version. Of course that Grub, I've limited experience with,
among other free Boot Arbitrators, wouldn't offer perhaps unique
applicability. Smart Boot Manager, though, is simplistic.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Mike Easter
Since the two H are small, there was room on the usb stick for the
current systemrescuecd SR which was just released today '20 Sep 12; it
is small enough to fit on a CD at 6xx meg and comes in 32 or 64bit.
So I Yumi added SR to the 2 H/s, and it is more current, running a linux
5.4.64, current xfce 4.14, ffx 78.0 and has a collection of useful tools
but no gsmart or some other usefuls on the older SR.

I'm pleased that so many of these little rescue/troubleshoot .iso/s can
fit onto a little 4G usb. I just added GPartEd after rescatux, giving
H15.2, HPE, SR, Rescatux, & GPartEd.

GPartEd is a fluxbox over Debian which boot after a few configurational
choices opens into a GUI GPartEd which is my preferred partition
manager. Its default browser is a lightweight NetSurf I'd never seen.
The distro/s webpage is excellent documentation for gparted the app (my
fave part ed). The dev managed to get all of that into a little 375 M
.iso, which is what makes putting all of these .iso/s onto one small
stick possible. https://gparted.org/display-doc.php?name=help-manual

SystemRescue is XFCE over Arch
Rescatux is LXQt over Deb, mostly Rescapp oriented

I believe the two Hirens are more useful for dealing w/ Win problems,
while the 3 linux are more useful for solving problems which might be
experienced in a dual boot environment of Win + Linux. It is most
likely that a dual boot is going to be grub boot manager.

Another approach to solving those boot problems is the commercial ware
by NeoSmart; EasyBCD and BCDBackup and NeoGrub.

Personally I would rather avoid wrecking something than fixing it.

[Arlen Holder]

Neat. I forgot about that command for the hardware testing tutorial!
o Win+R > %comspec% /k chkdsk C: /r {control+shift+enter}
The type of the file system is NTFS.
Cannot lock current drive.
Chkdsk cannot run because the volume is in use by another
process. Would you like to schedule this volume to be
checked the next time the system restarts? (Y/N) y
This volume will be checked the next time the system restarts.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

So I ran the check disk as a user as follows:
o Win+R > %comspec% /k chkdsk C: /r {control+shift+enter}

Note: I never use "cortana search" (never never never never!).

Then I booted and watched it for a while, but of course, it's boring:
o <Loading Image...>

I left chkdsk to do its four stages, which took about a half hour:
o Stage 1 ¡V verifying files;
o Stage 2 ¡V verifying indexes;
o Stage 3 ¡V verifying security descriptors;
o Stage 4 ¡V verifying Usn Journal and sectors.

Coming back to a login.
o Now what?

Where's the check disk log file anyway?
o Googling, I find it's a common question...

The first thing you're supposed to check, supposedly, is:
o Win+R > control > View by: Category
System and Security > Security and Maintenance > Maintenance >
Drive Status
You're looking for "All drives are working properly" of course.
o <Loading Image...>

One way to view the check disk log is have powershell create it:
o <Loading Image...>

o Win+R > powershell {control+shift+enter}
$path = "HKCU:\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\User Shell Folders"
$UserDesktop = (Get-ItemProperty -Path $path -Name "Desktop").Desktop
get-winevent -ProviderName "ChkDsk" | fl timecreated, message | out-file "$UserDesktop\ChkDskResults.txt"
get-winevent -FilterHashTable @{logname="Application"}| ?{$_.providername -match "wininit"} | fl timecreated, message | out-file "$UserDesktop\ChkDskResults.txt" -append

Another way to view the check disk log is the event viewer:
o <Loading Image...>

Open the Event Viewer
o Win+R > eventvwr
Event Viewer (Local} > Windows Logs > Application >
(Scroll down to see "Wininit (Windows Initialization)"

Checking file system on C:
The type of the file system is NTFS.
Volume label is foobar.
A disk check has been scheduled.
Windows will now check the disk.

Stage 1: Examining basic file system structure ...
270080 file records processed.
File verification completed.
Phase duration (File record verification): 6.55 seconds.
6980 large file records processed.
Phase duration (Orphan file record recovery): 0.00 milliseconds.
0 bad file records processed.
Phase duration (Bad file record checking): 1.90 milliseconds.

Stage 2: Examining file name linkage ...
1040 reparse records processed.
365912 index entries processed.
Index verification completed.
Phase duration (Index verification): 1.26 minutes.
0 unindexed files scanned.
Phase duration (Orphan reconnection): 299.97 milliseconds.
0 unindexed files recovered to lost and found.
Phase duration (Orphan recovery to lost and found): 1.21 seconds.
1040 reparse records processed.
Phase duration (Reparse point and Object ID verification): 10.31 milliseconds.

Stage 3: Examining security descriptors ...
Cleaning up 4196 unused index entries from index $SII of file 0x9.
Cleaning up 4196 unused index entries from index $SDH of file 0x9.
Cleaning up 4196 unused security descriptors.
Security descriptor verification completed.
Phase duration (Security descriptor verification): 233.36 milliseconds.
47917 data files processed.
Phase duration (Data attribute verification): 1.95 milliseconds.
CHKDSK is verifying Usn Journal...
36184984 USN bytes processed.
Usn Journal verification completed.
Phase duration (USN journal verification): 383.78 milliseconds.

Stage 4: Looking for bad clusters in user file data ...
270064 files processed.
File data verification completed.
Phase duration (User file recovery): 32.53 minutes.

Stage 5: Looking for bad, free clusters ... 204496592 free clusters processed.
Free space verification is complete.
Phase duration (Free space recovery): 0.00 milliseconds.
Windows has scanned the file system and found no problems.
No further action is required.

976708607 KB total disk space.
158175452 KB in 214336 files.
139824 KB in 47918 indexes.
0 KB in bad sectors.
406959 KB in use by the system.
65536 KB occupied by the log file.
817986372 KB available on disk.
4096 bytes in each allocation unit.
244177151 total allocation units on disk.
204496593 allocation units available on disk.

Total duration: 33.95 minutes (2037596 ms).
Internal Info: (a bunch of numbers)
Windows has finished checking your disk.
Please wait while your computer restarts.

An easier way to _find_ the log is to filter events:
o <Loading Image...>

To filter by events, Rightclick on:
Event Viewer (Local) > Windows Logs > Application
Select "Filter Current Log"
In the Event sources dropdown, check
[x]Chkdsk
[x]Winit
[OK]

You can also spit out the last few event viewer logs:
Get-EventLog -LogName Application -Source chkdsk | Select-Object -Last 5 -Property TimeGenerated,Message | Format-Table -Wrap| out-file "$env:userprofile\Desktop\CHKDSK_SCANS.txt"

There is apparently also wevtutil but I couldn't get it to work.
o wevtutil epl [Application/System/Security/etc] [savepath&filename]
<https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-server/administration/windows-commands/wevtutil>

Also there's a task scheduler option for check disk:
o <Loading Image...>
o Win+R > taskschd.msc
Task Scheduler (Local) > Task Scheduler Library
Microsoft > Windows > Chkdsk > ProactiveScan

<http://woshub.com/view-check-disk-chkdsk-results-in-windows-10/>
Note: "chkdsk C: /F /R" is probably what I should have run
because that will "fix" the bad sectors, or maybe even
"chkdsk C: /F /R /X" to unmount it first, or,
"chkdsk C: /f /offlinescanandfix" to check it offline.

Note: I could also have run a "Storage Diagnostic Tool" test:
stordiag.exe -collectEtw -checkfsconsistency -out %userprofile%\desktop

Note: There's also a check disk equivalent in powershell:
Repair-Volume ¡Vdriveletter C ¡Vscan
Repair-Volume ¡Vdriveletter C ¡Vofflinescanandfix
Repair-volume ¡Vdriveletter E ¡Vspotfix
Repair-Volume -DriveLetter EHI ¡VSpotFix
You can even scan drives on remote computers:
Repair-Volume ¡Vdriverletter c -scan ¡Vcimsession ny-fs01,ny-fs02,ny-dc01
And you can scan SMART status of HDD using "cmdlets"
Get-PhysicalDisk | Sort Size | FT FriendlyName, Size, MediaType,SpindleSpeed, HealthStatus, OperationalStatus -AutoSize

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Mike Easter
That is, this isn't a 'virgin' win10pro that is bsod/ing, it is a arlen
frankenholder win10pro, nicht wahr?

Das ist richtig Herr Easter!
o You might wonder why I haven't responded all day, Mike.

I got my first BSOD in days, this morning, when I woke up.
o It took me about six hours of repetitive booting to get the OS back.

By the time I booted to a stable OS, I had a dozen handwritten pages of
what happened, where I've been up and alive for, oh, about three hours now,
but it took me six hours to be booted to a stable OS.
(I need to write the steps up separately, so that others can benefit.)

I must have booted twenty to thirty times in that process, where I
documented every step with a photo if I could (some flashed by too fast).

Here's just the short summary of my day today...

o This is the PC hardware:
<https://i.postimg.cc/FR03FQMc/bsod201.jpg>

o This is just some of the dozen pages of steps it took to boot today:
<https://i.postimg.cc/gJzjkzQt/bsod202.jpg>

o BSOD #1 (with white lines) SYSTEM SERVICE EXCEPTION
<https://i.postimg.cc/BnCkxJXG/bsod203.jpg>

o BSOD #2 (with white lines) SYSTEM THREAD EXCEPTION NOT HANDLED
<https://i.postimg.cc/5t7rRpB7/bsod204.jpg>

o BSOD #3 SYSTEM THREAD EXCEPTION NOT HANDLED
<https://i.postimg.cc/RFWY5fGM/bsod205.jpg>

o BSOD #4 (just the white lines)
<https://i.postimg.cc/tT8MXTmF/bsod206.jpg>

o BSOD #5 (with white lines) DRIVER OVERRAN STACK BUFFER
<https://i.postimg.cc/FFJ6Ty7p/bsod207.jpg>

o BSOD #6 KERNEL SECURITY CHECK FAILURE
<https://i.postimg.cc/gkFTQxhW/bsod208.jpg>

o Choosing the latest restore point:
<https://i.postimg.cc/HswhgT07/bsod209.jpg>

o Back to Windows 10 again, like nothing ever happened:
<https://i.postimg.cc/bwqFY4LV/bsod210.jpg>

Now, it's working just fine!

[Arlen Holder]

Today I was on the old WinXP 1/2GB memory DELL laptop, missing a battery
and with a dead screen (so it is treated as a "desktop" in a weird way).

Given its main purpose is to tie to the scanner, I've pulled the Ethernet
cable so it hasn't been on the Internet for quite some time.

I got to thinking whether the Hirens Boot CD to WinXP would work on that
old BIOS laptop, and lo and behold, it worked just fine!

I was pleasantly surprised that the mouse seemed snappier and the file
system seemed to be accessed faster under the Hirens Boot USB to WinXP than
the original WinXP was, which was a pleasant surprise (Thanks Mike!).

In addition, I ran a few virus checks that were on the Hirens Boot USB
which was also nice, and a defrag operation (which quit due to lack of disk
space).

In summary, if you have an XP machine off the net, you might consider
booting to the Hirens XP which seems to work as well or better than the
original XP did.

Thanks Mike.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Arlen Holder
In summary, if you have an XP machine off the net, you might consider
booting to the Hirens XP which seems to work as well or better than the
original XP did.

That isn't the way I would 'do that' -- where 'that' is breathing some
life into some old hardware which is lying around fallow.

I have such an old low resource machine which I inherited as a
hand-me-down from a friend. It has an 'original' *legitimate* OEM WinXP
on its hdd; it is a Dell Inspiron 1300 laptop w/ 600 MHz Pentium M and 1
G of ram, BIOS 2006. Its battery doesn't work, but its screen does.

6 y ago I equipped it w/ a lightweight graphical linux as a dual boot;
that was a Mint 17 XFCE which runs fine, but is now out of its support
lifetime. I haven't gotten around to replacing that linux w/ a
currently supported v., but I have tested some options such as current
MX Linux, which also runs fine.

The biggest advantage of the linux over the OEM XP are that it runs a
modern browser.

In the case of your machine, a linux would also be a better choice for
it because:
- the Hirens wasn't 'intended' to be used as a OS except for its role
in troubleshooting
- it certainly wasn't MS's 'intention' to be providing an outdated old
OS for old hardware

Since your machine has 2G ram, it has even more linux options than my 1G
machine; likely the 'bottleneck' restricting choices would be what its
old graphics are, which we don't know at this point.

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Mike Easter

Post by Arlen Holder
In summary, if you have an XP machine off the net, you might consider
booting to the Hirens XP which seems to work as well or better than the
original XP did.

That isn't the way I would 'do that' -- where 'that' is breathing some
life into some old hardware which is lying around fallow.

Hi Mike,
Yes. But. In reality, I was needing a sneaker net because I scanned in a
document with my ancient Dell Inspiron B130 laptop connected, via USB, to
my almost as ancient HP laserjet 3200m which I only use as a scanner.

I needed to bring the scan to another machine, so I grabbed the recently
created winXP hiren's boot USB, and then figured, what the heck.

I may as well see if it boots on the ancient Dell laptop (it's so old it
has only 1/2GB of memory, and only a 149GB HDD - it's got to be more than
15 years old - and it's still (kind of sort of) kicking!

It booted, and it's still running virus scans as we speak.

Post by Mike Easter
The biggest advantage of the linux over the OEM XP are that it runs a
modern browser.

This is a good point of the modern tools for an old-as-hell laptop.
o And, another key advantage is you can put it back on the network.

As long as it works with the HP LJ 3200m scanner, I'm fine with Linux.

Post by Mike Easter
Since your machine has 2G ram, it has even more linux options than my 1G
machine; likely the 'bottleneck' restricting choices would be what its
old graphics are, which we don't know at this point.

Actually, it has only 1/2 GB of RAM.
o It's a $500 Dell Inspiron B130.

[David W. Hodgins]

Post by Arlen Holder
As long as it works with the HP LJ 3200m scanner, I'm fine with Linux.

$ grep 'HP LaserJet 3200' /usr/share/hplip/data/models/models.dat
model1=HP LaserJet 3200 All-in-One Printer
model2=HP LaserJet 3200se All-in-One Printer

Post by Arlen Holder

Post by Mike Easter
Since your machine has 2G ram, it has even more linux options than my 1G
machine; likely the 'bottleneck' restricting choices would be what its
old graphics are, which we don't know at this point.

Actually, it has only 1/2 GB of RAM.
o It's a $500 Dell Inspiron B130.

I have Mageia 7 running xfce4 on a toshiba portege with 1GB ram. That's slow
enough that trying to run on 1/2 GB would be swapping before it even starts
to load a desktop environment. It might be ok as a command line only system,
any but gui would be intolerably slow.

Regards, Dave Hodgins

[Mike Easter]

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by Arlen Holder
As long as it works with the HP LJ 3200m scanner, I'm fine with Linux.

$ grep 'HP LaserJet 3200' /usr/share/hplip/data/models/models.dat
model1=HP LaserJet 3200 All-in-One Printer
model2=HP LaserJet 3200se All-in-One Printer

Post by Arlen Holder

Post by Mike Easter
Since your machine has 2G ram, it has even more linux options than my 1G
machine; likely the 'bottleneck' restricting choices would be what its
old graphics are, which we don't know at this point.

Actually, it has only 1/2 GB of RAM.
o It's a $500 Dell Inspiron B130.

I misread his 1/2 as 2. 0.5 isn't much ram. I don't have anything
around here that low. Even my RPi3B is 1 G.

Post by David W. Hodgins
I have Mageia 7 running xfce4 on a toshiba portege with 1GB ram.
That's slow enough that trying to run on 1/2 GB would be swapping
before it even starts to load a desktop environment. It might be ok
as a command line only system, any but gui would be intolerably
slow.

I have a current Sparky minimal GUI that is pretty light.

It is OpenBox over Debian. The Raspbian on the RPi is OB & some LXDE
parts. Sparky uses Thunar file, LX term. Its free -m to the live
desktop is 237.

[Arlen Holder]

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by Arlen Holder
As long as it works with the HP LJ 3200m scanner, I'm fine with Linux.

$ grep 'HP LaserJet 3200' /usr/share/hplip/data/models/models.dat
model1=HP LaserJet 3200 All-in-One Printer
model2=HP LaserJet 3200se All-in-One Printer

Hi Mike,

Thanks for your purposefully helpful answer.
o It's good to know the HP LaserJet 3200m will work on Linux as a scanner.

Post by David W. Hodgins
I misread his 1/2 as 2. 0.5 isn't much ram. I don't have anything
around here that low. Even my RPi3B is 1 G.

Here are the specs for the Dell Inspiron B130
o <Loading Image...>
<http://www.notebookreview.com/notebookreview/dell-inspiron-b130-and-b120-review-pics-specs/>

o Intel Pentium M Processor 740 (1.73GHz/2MB Cache/400MHz FSB*)
o 15.4-inch WXGA display
o 512MB of RAM (2 stick configuration)
o Intel integrated Media Accelerator 900 graphics card
o 60GB Hard Drive (5400RPM)
o Microsoft Windows XP Home
o 24x CD Burner/DVD Combo drive
o Dell 1470 Internal Wireless 802.11a/b/g
o 56Kbps Modem and Integrated Network Card (ethernet)
o Dimensions: Height 1.41″, Width 14.0″, Depth 10.5″
o Weight: 6.7lbs (with 4-cell battery)
o 4-cell Lithium Ion Battery
o Ports: 3 USB 2.0, VGA out, Modem RJ-11, audio line-out
(for speakers headphones), external microphone port, ExpressCard 34 slot
o 1 yr. warranty
o Final Price (after using $250 off Dell coupon): $1,027 – $250 Off
with Dell Coupon Code + $49.00 Shipping + $69.17 Tax = $895.17
Note: * The Pentium M 740 actually has a 533MHz FSB
but operates only at 400MHz in the Dell Inspiron B130

I remember I got a "good deal" back in the day for the thing as I bought a
few as gifts, which I'm wont to do when I get a good price on electronics.

[Mike Easter]

Post by Arlen Holder

Post by David W. Hodgins

Post by Arlen Holder
As long as it works with the HP LJ 3200m scanner, I'm fine with Linux.

$ grep 'HP LaserJet 3200' /usr/share/hplip/data/models/models.dat
model1=HP LaserJet 3200 All-in-One Printer
model2=HP LaserJet 3200se All-in-One Printer

Hi Mike,
Thanks for your purposefully helpful answer.

You mis-attributed to me. That was David W. Hodgins grep read from
hplip .dat file.

Post by Arlen Holder
o It's good to know the HP LaserJet 3200m will work on Linux as a scanner.

Post by David W. Hodgins
I misread his 1/2 as 2. 0.5 isn't much ram. I don't have anything
around here that low. Even my RPi3B is 1 G.

Here are the specs for the Dell Inspiron B130
o <http://www.notebookreview.com/assets/9016.jpg>
<http://www.notebookreview.com/notebookreview/dell-inspiron-b130-and-b120-review-pics-specs/>
o Intel Pentium M Processor 740 (1.73GHz/2MB Cache/400MHz FSB*)
o 15.4-inch WXGA display
o 512MB of RAM (2 stick configuration)

The article says that Dell says the max ram is 1G, but as is often the
case, it also says users have found for themselves that it can take/use 2G.

It is hard to find a 'good deal' on old ram, but some people have access
to 'recycled' throwaway ram sticks which are practically free. With 2G
ram, that would be a much more functional machine; but not if you had to
purchase it retail -- the whole machine wouldn't be worth the cost of
the ram.

Post by Arlen Holder
o Intel integrated Media Accelerator 900 graphics card
o 60GB Hard Drive (5400RPM)
o Microsoft Windows XP Home
o 24x CD Burner/DVD Combo drive
o Dell 1470 Internal Wireless 802.11a/b/g
o 56Kbps Modem and Integrated Network Card (ethernet)

A fax machine.

Post by Arlen Holder
o Dimensions: Height 1.41″, Width 14.0″, Depth 10.5″
o Weight: 6.7lbs (with 4-cell battery)
o 4-cell Lithium Ion Battery
o Ports: 3 USB 2.0, VGA out, Modem RJ-11, audio line-out
(for speakers headphones), external microphone port, ExpressCard 34 slot
o 1 yr. warranty
o Final Price (after using $250 off Dell coupon): $1,027 – $250 Off
with Dell Coupon Code + $49.00 Shipping + $69.17 Tax = $895.17
Note: * The Pentium M 740 actually has a 533MHz FSB
but operates only at 400MHz in the Dell Inspiron B130
I remember I got a "good deal" back in the day for the thing as I bought a
few as gifts, which I'm wont to do when I get a good price on electronics.

Well you are very generous to be gifting such hardware in '06 dollars.

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Mike Easter
You mis-attributed to me. That was David W. Hodgins grep read from
hplip .dat file.

Well then, thanks go to David Hodgins for stepping in to be purposefully
helpful to a fellow Usenet'er. (I didn't see his post, but he may not have
posted to the group I read your note from, where even I admit the offshoots
don't belong anymore on some of the groups).

Post by Mike Easter
The article says that Dell says the max ram is 1G, but as is often the
case, it also says users have found for themselves that it can take/use 2G.
It is hard to find a 'good deal' on old ram, but some people have access
to 'recycled' throwaway ram sticks which are practically free. With 2G
ram, that would be a much more functional machine; but not if you had to
purchase it retail -- the whole machine wouldn't be worth the cost of
the ram.

Yup. It's only the machine because I have a spare office with a spare
printer with a spare computer such that I never bothered to set up any
other computer or printer to be the "home scanner".

Turns out 500MB of RAM is fine for that home scanner purpose.
o What's nice is that the Hiren's XP Boot USB is good for when the OS dies.

Post by Mike Easter
A fax machine.

Yea. I used to use it as a fax machine.
o But when is the last time you sent a fax?

Post by Mike Easter
Well you are very generous to be gifting such hardware in '06 dollars.

Gifting low-cost good price-to-performance hardware is my schtick!

Examples over the years...
o What do you think of the LG Stylus3 plus (T-Mobile LG-TP450) as a gift phone?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/wkttc2CxxzM>
o Phablet stocking stuffers: iPhone 7 versus LG Stylo 3 Plus price/performance hardware comparison
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/ls71mnkj4jk>
o Stocking stuffers for Christmas, great Android phones around $150 (what do you suggest?)
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/wAodwFeI4V8>

My current Android phone I bought as a gift handful on Black Friday
o Google subtracted $200 + $20 tax if I consented to one day on Google Fi

Where I needed one for myself because a kid decided to go swimming with the
old Android LG Stylo 3 Plus I had gifted for Christmas two years prior, so
I replaced that 2-year old now soaking wet 2017 gifted $130 LG Stylo 3 Plus
with the $100 Moto G7 (of which I gave a bunch away as 2019 gifts and kept
one for myself).

o Does anyone here have Google Fi service? (What do you think of it?)
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/VwyaI4EgIts>

And where I compared at the time, to Apple's hardware as gifts:
o What is the closest Apple iPhone comparison to the $100 64GB 4GB RAM Motorola G7?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/UIYH1QYp8Pw>

Notice non-Apple hardware just gets better, faster, & cheaper over time!
o Does the best price:performance choice in any common consumer electronics device NOT get better, faster, and CHEAPER over time?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/eSudn2SUkws>

So lately, I've been giving less Apple hardware & more Android hardware
o In addition to a bunch of gifted S-mode Windows Home computers

o Is there freeware extent to convert Win10S to Win10H WITHOUT enabling the Win10S laptop Wi-Fi?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.freeware/MwzjUei-0Oo>

It turns out, often price buys you nothing in terms of hardware value:
o Facts please: What would a 10X more expensive phone actually buy me that actually matters?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/SfGKMN43_ss>

Where I'm always on the lookout for gift hardware for my extended family:
o Current Android & iOS smartphones on sale now for less than $250
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/p2s-rDt_2FQ>

[Mike Easter]

Post by Arlen Holder
o But when is the last time you sent a fax?

Last year I 'had to' send many pages. It was a PITA. It would have
been much easier to email, but the recipient couldn't do that.

I was very glad that the combination of an ancient WinModem was
compatible w/ VoIP faxing. I used the old WinXP fax accessory and 'Data
Fax SoftModem w/ SmartCP' (in device mgr) whatever that means.

I also have 2 able-bodied external modems which are more linux-capable
than the WinModem. And an old trusty Brother freestanding w/ thermal
paper. If I recall, it couldn't quite pass muster for the VoIP
transmission test. One of either send or receive didn't.

[Arlen Holder]

UPDATE:
a. I was able to get Windows to create crash logs finally (it's not intuitive)
b. The crash logs (or BSOD messages) tentatively implicate 3 specific files:
c:\windows\system32\drivers\fltmgr.sys (implicated in crash logs)
c:\windows\system32\ntoskrnl.exe (secondarily indicated in crash logs)
c:\windows\system32\win32kbase.sys (implicated in BSOD screen message)
c. All three files test good.
sfc /verifyfile=c:\windows\system32\drivers\fltmgr.sys (runs in a second)
sfc /verifyfile=c:\windows\system32\ntoskrnl.exe (takes a second to run)
sfc /verifyfile=c:\windows\system32\win32kbase.sys (runs in a second)

Technical questions that resulted are:
1. How can we tell exactly which restore point Windows finally ended up with?
2. How can we update all the outdated hardware drivers at once?

Gory Details (written so that many others can follow in our footsteps):

Last I reported yesterday afternoon, I had scheduled a checkdisk to run
on boot at about 9:20 PM after running sfc and dism cleanup operations:
o <Loading Image...>
o <Loading Image...>
o <Loading Image...>
o <Loading Image...>
o <Loading Image...>
o <Loading Image...>
o <Loading Image...>

Just my luck that it BSOD'd during that checkdisk operation at about 9:26 PM:
o <Loading Image...>
Your device ran into a problem and needs to restart.
We're just collecting some error info, and then you can restart.
0% complete
System Thread Exception Not Handled

Then, it BSOD'd instantly on the very next reboot at about 9:28 PM.
o <Loading Image...>
Your device ran into a problem and needs to restart.
We're just collecting some error info, and then you can restart.
100% complete
Kernel Mode Heap Corruption

Note that the log file appears to have been created 100%.

o The third reboot then brought up the POST screen, which is a good sign:
<Loading Image...>

o Then came the obligatory "Preparing Automatic Repair" & ferris dots:
<Loading Image...>

o And then the "Diagnosing your PC" and ferris dots:
<Loading Image...>

o And the always inevitable "Windows couldn't load correctly":
<Loading Image...>
To which I pressed [Restore]

o Which brought us to the "Attempting repairs" screen with ferris dots:
<Loading Image...>

o After a flag, ferris dots, & a flag with ferris dots, "Please wait":
<Loading Image...>

o Once booted, I noticed from my menus Windows had reverted to an old
restore point, but I can't figure out how to tell which one it used.
(You'd think it's the last but it's not always the last one, particularly
when it takes many reboots to finally get to the login screen.)

o I ran the Windows Reliability Monitor which finally had some information:
<Loading Image...>
Win+R > perfmon /rel
Control Panel > System & Security > Security & Maintenance

o The first of two logged failures was not all that informatively useful:
<Loading Image...>
Control Panel > System & Security > Security & Maintenance > Problem Details
Date: 9/25/2020 9:38 PM
Problem: Windows failed to start because of missing system files
Description: Windows was unable to determine the problem.
Error code: 0x13a

o The second of two logged failures was only slightly more informative:
<Loading Image...>
Control Panel > System & Security > Security & Maintenance > Problem Details

This is the first of two entries at 9:39 PM:
Problem: Windows stopped working 9/25/2020 9:39 PM
Description
The computer has rebooted from a bugcheck.
The bugcheck was: 0x0000013a
(0x0000000000000012, 0xffffca0853202100, 0xffffca0858beb000, 0x0000000000000000)
A dump was saved in: C:\Windows\MEMORY.DMP.
Report Id: ba013a5c-613d-4fae-9d5a-a26f9ab3b1af.

This is the second of two entries at 9:39 PM:

Problem: Shut down unexpectedly 9/25/2020 9:39 PM
Problem signature
Problem Event Name: BlueScreen
Code: 13a
Parameter 1: 12
Parameter 2: ffffca0853202100
Parameter 3: ffffca0858beb000
Parameter 4: 0
OS version: 10_0_19041
Service Pack: 0_0
Product: 256_1
OS Version: 10.0.19041.2.0.0.256.48
Locale ID: 1033

o Than I ran the Windows System Event Viewer:
<Loading Image...>
Win+R > eventvwr.msc
EventViewer (Local) > Windows Logs > System > (right click)
Filter Current Log > Event IDs = 41, 1074, 6006, 6008

Information: 9/25/2020 9:24:30 PM Source=User32 EventID=1074 Task=None
General: The process C:\Windows\Explorer.EXE (pcname) has initiated
the restart of computer pcname on behalf of user pcname\username
for the following reason: Other (Unplanned)
Reason Code: 0x0
Shutdown Type: restart
Comment:
General:
Log Name: System
Source: User32
Event ID: 1074
Level: Information
User: pcname\username
OpCode: Info
Logged: 9/25/2020 9:24:30 PM
Task Category: None
Keywords: Classic
Computer: pcname

Information: 9/25/2020 9:24:36 PM Source=EventLog EventID=6006 Task=None
General: The Event log service was stopped.
Log Name: System
Source: EventLog
Event ID: 6006
Level: Information
User: N/A
OpCode: Info
Logged: 9/25/2020 9:24:36 PM
Task Category: None
Keywords: Classic
Computer: pcname

o Then I ran "WhoCrashed" which implicated "fltmgr.sys" & "ntoskrnl.exe":
<Loading Image...>

On Fri 9/25/2020 9:28:05 PM your computer crashed or a problem was reported
crash dump file: C:\Windows\MEMORY.DMP
This was probably caused by the following module: fltmgr.sys
(FLTMGR!FltCbdqInitialize+0x2EC2)
Bugcheck code: 0x13A (0x12, 0xFFFFCA0853202100, 0xFFFFCA0858BEB000, 0x0)
Error: KERNEL_MODE_HEAP_CORRUPTION
file path: C:\Windows\system32\drivers\fltmgr.sys
product: Microsoft(c) Windows(c) Operating System
company: Microsoft Corporation
description: Microsoft Filesystem Filter Manager
Bug check description: This indicates that the kernel mode heap manager has detected corruption in a heap.
This appears to be a typical software driver bug and is not likely to be caused by a hardware problem.
The crash took place in a file system driver. Since there is no other responsible driver detected,
this could be pointing to a malfunctioning drive or corrupted disk.
It's suggested that you run CHKDSK.

On Fri 9/25/2020 9:28:05 PM your computer crashed or a problem was reported
crash dump file: C:\Windows\Minidump\092520-31906-01.dmp
This was probably caused by the following module: ntoskrnl.exe (nt+0x3F3EA0)
Bugcheck code: 0x13A (0x12, 0xFFFFCA0853202100, 0xFFFFCA0858BEB000, 0x0)
Error: KERNEL_MODE_HEAP_CORRUPTION
file path: C:\Windows\system32\ntoskrnl.exe
product: Microsoft(c) Windows(c) Operating System
company: Microsoft Corporation
description: NT Kernel & System
Bug check description: This indicates that the kernel mode heap manager has detected corruption in a heap.
This appears to be a typical software driver bug and is not likely to be caused by a hardware problem.
The crash took place in the Windows kernel.
Possibly this problem is caused by another driver that cannot be identified at this time.

Conclusion
2 crash dumps have been found and analyzed.
No offending third party drivers have been found.
Connsider [sic] using WhoCrashed Professional which offers more detailed
analysis using symbol resolution.
Also configuring your system to produce a full memory dump may help you.

o Time to check the hash for these three implicated files:
Name: fltMgr.sys
Size: 430392 bytes (420 KiB)
SHA256: 6390C3D54E955C42E73B74B1FDFB7BA45965DCBA273B34EDADAC265ADCDD9731
(Implicated by the crash logs.)

Name: ntoskrnl.exe
Size: 10847552 bytes (10 MiB)
SHA256: A577850D67D1B4DF94E64B3309169E20F3850D4BFA54C40DC9F4F09722E2F5EA
(Implicated by the crash logs.)

Name: win32kbase.sys
Size: 2951680 bytes (2882 KiB)
SHA256: 0BE65ECF2983B13A8C25687A5695A2542D184DEC45DD28C7D38190F25C06B3DF
(Implicated by an earlier BSOD message.)

o But nothing seems to be wrong with those the implicated files:
Win+R > cmd {control+shift+enter}
sfc /verifyfile=c:\windows\system32\drivers\fltmgr.sys (runs in a second)
sfc /verifyfile=c:\windows\system32\ntoskrnl.exe (takes a second to run)
sfc /verifyfile=c:\windows\system32\win32kbase.sys (runs in a second)

o I also ran the following commands, all of which came up clean:
sfc /scannow (mine took about 10 minutes for the first run)
sfc /scannow (mine took about 4 minutes for the second run)
sfc /scannow (mine took about 4 minutes for the third run)
Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /CheckHealth (mine took five seconds)
Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /ScanHealth (mine took thirteen minutes)
Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /RestoreHealth (mine took about ten minutes)
sfc /scannow (mine took about seven minutes for this last run)

o Ran BlueScreenView which used C:\Windows\MiniDump implicating the same files:
<Loading Image...>

Dump File: 092520-31906-01.dmp
Crash Time: 9/25/2020 9:28:05 PM
Bug Check Code: 0x0000013a
Parameter 1: 00000000'00000012
Parameter 2: ffffca08'53202100
Parameter 3: ffffca08'58beb000
Parameter 4: 00000000'00000000
Caused by Driver: FLTMGR.SYS
Caused by Address: FLTMGR.SYS+aa2f
Processor: x64
Crash Address: ntoskrnl.exe+3f3ea0
Full Path: C:\Windows\Minidump\092520-31906-01.dmp
Processors Count: 4
Major Version: 15
Minor Version: 19041
Dump File Size: 602,252
Dump File Time: 9/25/2020 9:39:31 PM

o Googling for what fltmgr.sys is, a problem is every scam on the planet
tells you a teeny tiny bit about the file, and then tries to sell you
their driver fixit tools.
o What Is Fltmgr.sys?
<https://www.partitionwizard.com/disk-recovery/fltmgr-sys.html>
It's a MS Windows file related to the file system filter manager.
It's used to make sure all files stay in their proper locations.

o What Is Fltmgr?
<https://www.file.net/process/fltmgr.sys.html>
Microsoft Filesystem Filter Manager is an essential Windows process
that allows installed files to be placed into their respective directories.
This utility is installed with the Windows OS, and is only triggered
when a minifilter driver is loaded. The Filter manager then connects
with the files system stack for a target volume.

o What causees FltMgr.sys Errors?
<https://www.personalcomputerfixes.com/how-to-prevent-fltmgr-sys-blue-screen-errors/>
The fltmgr.sys error is caused when Windows cannot read or process files
that are on the hard drive, usually because the File System Manager is
damaged or unreadable. If this is the case, it can cause hard drives
to stop working and the blue screen to appear.

o Googling for what ntoskrnl is,

o Googling for what win32kbase.sys is, I find the same scam tactics:
o ntoskrnl.exe (Wikipedia)
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ntoskrnl.exe>
In computing ntoskrnl.exe (short for Windows NT operating system kernel
executable), also known as kernel image, provides the kernel and
executive layers of the Microsoft Windows NT kernel space.

o Fix Ntoskrnl.exe BSOD on WIndows 10
<https://www.partitionwizard.com/disk-recovery/ntoskrnlexe-bsod.html>

o What causes the ntoskrnl.exe error?
<https://www.auslogics.com/en/articles/fix-ntoskrnl-exe-bsod/>
There's no one thing that could be said to be the cause.
The issue could be software or hardware related.
But the possible factors include:
Your device drivers are outdated, corrupt, or incompatible.
Faulty RAM.
Your RAM and local storage may be inadequate.
You overclocked your devices.
Some of your system files are corrupt.

o I checked my driver update which says I'm updated just fine:
Win+I > Update & Security > Windows Update > [Check for updates]

o I bit and tried the "auslogics driver update" but it will only update
three drivers every 4 hours (go figure).

<https://www.auslogics.com/en/articles/fix-ntoskrnl-exe-bsod/>
<https://downloads.auslogics.com/en/driver-updater/driver-updater-setup.exe>

Name: driver-updater-setup.exe
Size: 12768144 bytes (12 MiB)
SHA256: A9A07BCDF2D9663FC54B42DC2E754BD9AADABD8DA9D7CF428618808B7F076F81
C:\Program Files (x86)\Auslogics\Driver Updater
C:\app\hardware\driver\auslogic_driver_updater

When I ran the crippleware, it said:
ATTENTION: 10 drivers on your PC are either outdated or corrupt.

AMD SMBus Installed 8/30/2017 Available 9/25/2018 Outdated
PCI Standard ISA Bridge Installed 6/21/2006 Available 7/16/2012 Outdated
HID-compliant mouse Installed 6/21/2006 Available 4/24/2010 Outdated
Disk drive Installed 6/21/2006 Available 8/11/2013 Outdated
Microsoft iSCSI Initiator Installed 6/21/2006 Available 11/13/2008 Outdated
Standard Dual Channel PCI IDE Controller Installed 6/21/2006 Available 6/28/2013 Outdated
Standard Dual Channel PCI IDE Controller Installed 6/21/2006 Available 6/28/2013 Outdated
Realtek USB 2.0 Card Reader Installed 3/15/2018 Available 4/1/2019 Outdated
Realtek PCIe GbE Family Controller Installed 4/10/2015 Available 12/6/2018 Outdated
Generic PnP Monitor Installed 6/21/2006 Available 9/16/2010 Outdated

o I tried to update the remaining 7 device drivers manually:
Win+R > devmgmt.msc
And then I right clicked > Update Drivers - HID-Compliant Mouse >
Search automatically for drivers (but all I tested simply reported):
"The best drivers for your device are already installed"

What I'll do is every four hours, I'll update another 3 drivers.

o Googling for a good free driver update tool, I find this article:
o 11 Best Free Driver Updater Tools
<https://www.lifewire.com/free-driver-updater-tools-2619206>
1. Driver Booster
2. DriverPack Solution
3. Snappy Driver Installer
4. Driver Talent
5. DriversCloud
6. DriverIdentifier
7. Free Driver Scout
8. Driver Easy
9. Device Doctor
10. DriverHub
11. DriverMax

Where I opened a thread on what's the best update driver software:
o What's the one free Windows 10 driver update tool you prefer most and why?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.freeware/zhWjvKgDBt4>
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/-yDz26GC6zA>

[Arlen Holder]

UPDATE:

The only update I want to make, since it irks me when people don't close
the loop after getting such excellent & friendly help, is that I haven't
had a BSOD for, oh, let me see based on my restore point logs...
Win+R > systempropertiesprotection

The last BSOD was 9/27 at 3am.
I swapped the order of the memory, but I doubt that made any difference.
I also ran a series of sfc and dism and check-disk commands.

The BSOD crash logs implicated fltmgr.sys first, and ntoskrnl.exe next, but
if you google them, you'll find 99% bullshit (spam crap for software to
"clean up your computer") and barely 1% real technical advice, all of it
being to just run the sfc, dism, and check-disk commands & to update
drivers.

So I did all that.

Dunno if anything else has improved, but all the drivers that would update
are updated, using Dumo crippleware, Auslogics crippleware, & DriverPack
crapware, even as Windows itself never complained about the drivers via:
Win+R > verifier
Win+R > devmgmt.msc
Win+I > Update & Security

And worse, Windows refuses to even say that the drivers need updating, so
it's hard to blame Windows for that.

The machine is almost always running, so there have been plenty of chances
for a BSOD, but I'll let you know if/when the next one happens.

It's only fair since you spent your valuable time & energy to help me.

[Arlen Holder]

UPDATE <Loading Image...>

Got my first BSOD since 9/26 when I awoke this morning:
o Your device ran into a problem and needs to restart.
o We're just collecting some error info, and then you can restart.
o 100% complete
o Unexpected kernel mode trap
<https://i.postimg.cc/HnY00z47/winbsod01b.jpg>

Machine runs 24/7 with sleep, hibernate, fastboot all turned off
o Also disabled are reboot-after-crash & reboot after update

That way, I get the information from the BSOD screen
o And the machine doesn't restore to older RPs without me knowing it

All drivers have been updated to the latest I can possibly find:
o <Loading Image...>

I shut down the machine to a cold state (light off the motherboard & PS)
o Then I shuffled the 4 memory cards, outside to middle, middle to outside

Then I did the cold reboot process with monitors on the power strip
o And the machine booted to the login prompt without argument

I immediately created a new restore point, so that I know where I was:
o Win+R > systempropertiesprotection > [Create]

I then ran "WhoCrashed", but it only sees the crash dumps from 9/26.
o Next I ran BlueScreenView, which also only sees the 9/26 crash logs.

Why doesn't this new BSOD today create a crash log file?

Let's check the "automatic memory dump" settings:
Win+R > systempropertiesadvanced > Startup and Recovery > [Settings]
Default Operating system:
[Windows 10]
System startup:
[x]Time to display list of operating systems [10]seconds
[x]Time to display recovery options when needed [30]seconds
System failure:
[x]Write an event to the system log
[_]Automatically restart
Write debugging information
[Automatic memory dump]
Dump file:
[%SystemRoot%\memory.dmp]
[_]Overwrite any existing file
[x]Disable automatic deletion of memory dumps when disk space is low

Maybe I need to have checked the "overwrite" button?
o I would have presumed it can make a new one next to it?

For now, I checked the overwrite button...
o Whenever I get a crash log, I can manually copy it to a safe place

I ran these move commands to ensure the log name is available:
o Win+R > cmd {control+shift+enter}
o move %SystemRoot%\memory.dmp c:\data\sys\bsod\20200925_memory.dmp
o move %SystemRoot%\Minidump\092520-31906-01.dmp c:\data\sys\bsod\.
o move %LocalAppData%\crashdumps\*.dmp c:\data\sys\bsod\.

I decided to change my page size from the default 2.5GB managed by Windows
to more than my memory (> 16GB) just in case that will help gather info.

Win+R > systempropertiesadvanced > Performance > [Settings] > [Advanced]
Virtual memory Total paging file size for all drives: 2432 MB [Change]
[x]Automaticaly manage paging file size for all drivers
Uncheck that... and select
(o)Custom size
Initial size (MB): 9216
Maximum size (MB): 9216
(it says I need to reboot.)

As usual, I ran these obligatory steps after the BSOD:
1. sfc /scannow (should take about 10 minutes for the first run)
Windows Resource Protection did not find any integrity violations.
2. sfc /scannow (should take about 4 minutes for the second run)
3. sfc /scannow (should take about 4 minutes for the third run)
4. Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /CheckHealth (should take 5 seconds)
No component store corruption detected.
5. Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /ScanHealth (should take about 13 minutes)
6. Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /RestoreHealth should take about 10 minutes)
7. sfc /scannow (should take about 7 minutes for this last run)
8. chkdsk /f /r C:
9. shutdown.exe /r /f /t 5 /c "Reboot in 5 seconds"

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Arlen Holder
9. shutdown.exe /r /f /t 5 /c "Reboot in 5 seconds"

Just to finish up explaining how to recover from a BSOD
o Because this thread is intended to help others solve their BSOD issues

The check disk /r /f ran to completion after rebooting:
o <Loading Image...>
o <Loading Image...>
o <Loading Image...>

The checkdisk logs show zero errors:
<Loading Image...>
o Win+R > eventvwr
o Event Viewer (Local) > Windows Logs > Application
o Find > wininit > [Find Next]
A disk check has been scheduled.
Windows will now check the disk.
Stage 1: Examining basic file system structure ...
0 bad file records processed.
Stage 2: Examining file name linkage ...
0 unindexed files recovered to lost and found.
Stage 3: Examining security descriptors ...
Usn Journal verification completed.
Stage 4: Looking for bad clusters in user file data ...
File data verification completed.
Stage 5: Looking for bad, free clusters ...
Free space verification is complete.
Windows has scanned the file system and found no problems.
No further action is required.
0 KB in bad sectors
Total duration: 55.69 minutes (3341634 ms).

In summary, after a BSOD, these 10 sfc & DISM & chkdsk steps are
veritably required to ensure the integrity of your Windows file system.
0. Win+R > cmd {control+shift+enter}
1. sfc /scannow
2. sfc /scannow
3. sfc /scannow
4. Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /CheckHealth
5. Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /ScanHealth
6. Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /RestoreHealth
7. sfc /scannow
8. chkdsk /f /r C:
9. shutdown.exe /r /f /t 5 /c "Reboot in 5 seconds"
10. Win+R > eventvwr > Windows Logs > Application > Find "wininit"

[Arlen Holder]

Did you ever find the problem i would have rolled back the Nvidea driver i
had that problem once and rolling the driver back fixed it until they
relised a fixed updated driver the next month.

Hi Andy,

Thanks for sticking with this since there are three things I am wont to do:
1. I always (almost always, eventually) figure out the problem cause, and,
2. I often try to learn as much as I can about debugging in the process,
3. And, I sometimes write up the gory details in the form of tutorials.

Hence, everyone benefits from any troubleshooting we collectively do.

To that end of troubleshooting, I've learned a lot, and I've stress tested
a lot, but I haven't yet definitively figured out the problem - but I do
not think it's the Nvidia drivers, if only because the BSOD happened even
after I had the Nvidia card removed from the system for months
(since the AMD-based motherboard has its own graphics output).

So I put the Nvidia GeForce 210 card back into the PCI slot, and it
BSOD'd with or without that specific graphics card being involved.

As you may be aware, I tested the memory (Memtest86 v4 for BIOS) for
24 hours, but I still think it "may" be memory related simply because,
consistently, when I reshuffle the memory, the boot-after-BSOD is
successful every time, whereas if I don't reshuffle the memory cards,
that's not always the case (yes, I know it's flimsy evidence).

I've tested all the drivers using Microsoft "Verifier.exe", and
I've updated all the drivers that could be updated (using Dumo to
tell me what's available), and I've identified the memory location
where the BSOD occurred
o ntoskrnl.exe (nt+0x3F3EA0)
Bugcheck code: 0x139 (0x3, 0xFFFFF30F99097970, 0xFFFFF30F990978C8, 0x0)
o ntkrnlmp.exe (nt!setjmpex+0x8279)
Bugcheck code: 0x139 (0x3, 0xFFFFF30F99097970, 0xFFFFF30F990978C8, 0x0)

I'm slowly coming to grips with how to proceed to debug _that_ error.
o Meanwhile I'm running a long-term physical test of the memory sticks

Right now, I have memory card 1 (of 4) in one of the four slots.
It hasn't BSOD'd since I did that - but of course - that tells me nothing.

However, what I plan on doing is putting that memory card in all
four slots, and if it still doesn't BSOD for a while,
I'm gonna "presume" tentatively that it's not the slots.

I might then do the same with memory card 2, but overall,
there are so many permutations and combinations I can run
with the four memory slots and four memory cards that if ONE slot
or ONE card is bad, I think the BSOD may finger it.

Dunno yet... but every single day I try something new;
it's just that most of the time there's nothing to report.

Here's a synopses of some of the related threads though...
o Windows 10 BSOD indicates a hardware problem - but what hardware is the problem?
<https://alt.comp.os.windows-10.narkive.com/oL7PTNKu/windows-10-bsod-indicates-a-hardware-problem-but-what-hardware-is-the-problem>
<http://www.pcbanter.net/showthread.php?t=1110105>
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/u0ay9h777Wg>

o What's the one free Windows 10 driver update tool you prefer most & why?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/-yDz26GC6zA>

o Tutorial: How to update a driver that Windows just doesn't want to update
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/a23fY9CM6rY>

o Tutorial: How to delete a specific restore point in Windows 10 (e.g., after an errant program such as driverpack created it!)
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/MbtX0Y_U0dg>

o Tutorial creating & using Hirens Boot CD & MemTest86 diagnostic stress testing tools for USB boot to Windows 10 PE & WinXPmini on BIOS & UEFI
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/OlpQK3Uy7K8>

o What PC hardware diagnostic stress-testing freeware can you recommend?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/a6aAvxnDRB8>

o What else in Win10 can we turn off that hinders successful rebooting after a BSOD event that can chew up the operating system?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/DlMnG1klEhc>

o What does it mean when a CPU won't wake up from its S3 state?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/YJw0idlompc>

o Is there an option to completely shut off a Windows 10 desktop (not just go to sleep, hibernate, or fastboot)?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/WVUpUtA_ExA>

o Windows 10 v2004 update repeatedly fails to update non existent keyboard but keeps trying forever (how to stop that nonsense?)
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/Npcs-xbnQdU>

o Tutorial creating & using Hirens Boot CD & MemTest86 diagnostic stress testing tools for USB boot to Windows 10 PE & WinXPmini on BIOS & UEFI
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.freeware/VWG0NNyGNHc>

o What PC hardware diagnostic stress-testing freeware can you recommend?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.freeware/dkkdOmL95d8>

o What does it mean when the Event Viewer (eventvwr.msc) says "Report Sent"?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/WG9y9YNVeH4>

Together, there must be hundreds of annotated screenshots so people
can see exactly what's going on, such as these in just one post
in that last thread.
a. I received a BSOD today which I am methodically diagnosing step by step.
<Loading Image...>
b. One of the score of steps is to see what the event viewer tells me.
<Loading Image...>
c. I noticed some events cause a report to be generated and then "sent".
<Loading Image...>
d. Others cause a report to be generated, but, apparently not to be "sent".
<Loading Image...>
e. Still others, cause a report neither to be generated nor to be "sent".
<Loading Image...>

[Arlen Holder]

What i would do is add memory one slot at a time until you get the blue
screen of death again then remove the last stick of memory and if it goes
away you have found the bad stick of memory and yes they can go bad in time.
Especially the cheap off brand ram that is sold for a low price.
I only use PNY for my systems as i don't game.

Hi Andy,

I just snapped this screenshot of what I'm testing right now:
o <Loading Image...>

I want to thank you as I very much appreciate & much need your advice.
o Particularly because the memory passed a MEMTEST86v4 24-hour test

I'm gonna hone in on those memory cards... or those memory slots on the MB
o Since I've almost exhausted all the testing I can do on the drivers

I've been getting these BSOD's since December of last year, where I haven't
yet pinned it down to the cause, but about the only consistent fact is that
"juggling" the memory cards, seems to make the next boot more reliable
after any given BSOD.

That is, if I get a BSOD and then just reboot, I've documented in this
thread that often, it could takes hours of reboot attempts; but if I simply
"juggle" the memory cards, then the _next_ reboot attempt usually works.

This "juggling" can be that I change the order of the four 4GB memory
cards; or that I put only one card in, where right now I have card #3 in
bank #2, but that was just a random selection after the last BSOD.
o <https://i.postimg.cc/GpGdHnxs/bsod213.jpg>

Interestingly, it has been, oh, maybe over a week since I did that, without
any BSOD (and I've been running driver verifier & CPU stress testing all
along).

What I'll do on my next boot, is, as you suggested, _add_ another memory
card, and then test for at least a week. If that goes well, I'll add
another card, and test for a week. And then add the last card & test.

If the BSOD happens, I "may" have found a bad memory card, which I can then
further test alone by MEMTEST86v4 (for BIOS) or by some other methods.

[Arlen Holder]

UPDATE:
o <Loading Image...>

o *How to Test RAM: Making Sure Bad Memory Isn't Crashing Your PC*
<https://www.tomshardware.com/how-to/how-to-test-ram>
"One option preferred by us at Tom's Hardware is HCI Design's MemTest.
The good thing about this is you don't have to any pre-booting
and there are no directions. You just run it."

o Downloading MemTest (free)
<https://hcidesign.com/memtest/download.html>
<https://hcidesign.com/memtest/MemTest.zip>
[X:\software\hardware\memory\hcimemtest\MemTest.zip]
Name: MemTest.zip
Size: 17671 bytes (17 KiB)
SHA256: 08960F448F4514E7C2D388420560D7D03F5F0A54EC8F9663D66C887B8E4679E6

o Unzip & move MemTest c:\app\hardware\ram\hcimemtest\
c:\app\hardware\ram\hcimemtest\memtest.exe
Name: memtest.exe
Size: 40960 bytes (40 KiB)
SHA256: 5E2D1B0E56095D4D219F3A606E46CE5DE3220FDF3CF55A6E405D3946F25792A6

o Create a link & SendTo populate your Taskbar accordion cascade menu tree:
c:\menu\hardware\ram\memtest.lnk
TARGET: C:\app\hardware\ram\hcimemtest\memtest.exe
STARTIN: C:\app\hardware\ram\hcimemtest

o Run the program as many times as needed to simultaneously test RAM:
Taskbar > menu > hardware > ram > memtest.lnk
Enter megabytes of RAM to test === All unused RAM
[Start Testing]

Could not allocate 4095 MB
Windows limits the amount of contiguous RAM MemTest can allocate
to between 2 and 3.5GB. To test all your RAM, run more than one copy
of MemTest simultaneously and set each copy to test a portion of
available RAM. Running more than one copy of MemTest does not
lower the quality of the test (and can even improve it if you have
multiple cores or CPUs).

Enter megabytes of RAM to test === 2
[Start Testing]
(instance 1)

o Run Taskbar > menu > hardware > ram > memtest.lnk
Enter megabytes of RAM to test === 2
[Start Testing]
(instance 2)

Note that every installation goes 'where it belongs' (which you define):
o <https://i.postimg.cc/L8w5Cxmr/memtest01.jpg>

[Arlen Holder]

Post by Arlen Holder
o Downloading MemTest (free)
<https://hcidesign.com/memtest/download.html>

Update:
o <Loading Image...>
o <https://i.postimg.cc/L8w5Cxmr/memtest01.jpg>

I don't know how "good" this HCI "MemTest" freeware is that Tom's Hardware
recommended, but I can say it has been running all morning and yet I
haven't "felt" any impact of it running, while I concurrently use the
machine.

If it actually works, then the huge advantage it has over MemTest86 v4 is
that not only does it work no matter if you're BIOS or UEFI, but it doesn't
require the machine to be unusable while the memory tests are running.

[Charlie+]

On Mon, 26 Oct 2020 20:58:19 -0000 (UTC), Arlen Holder

Post by Arlen Holder

Post by Arlen Holder
o Downloading MemTest (free)
<https://hcidesign.com/memtest/download.html>

o <https://i.postimg.cc/tCS6LhzB/memtest02.jpg>
o <https://i.postimg.cc/L8w5Cxmr/memtest01.jpg>
I don't know how "good" this HCI "MemTest" freeware is that Tom's Hardware
recommended, but I can say it has been running all morning and yet I
haven't "felt" any impact of it running, while I concurrently use the
machine.
If it actually works, then the huge advantage it has over MemTest86 v4 is
that not only does it work no matter if you're BIOS or UEFI, but it doesn't
require the machine to be unusable while the memory tests are running.

Just might be of interest: There is a 4.7GB ISO torrent version of
Hiren's Boot Disk which contains a shed-load of additional tools! C+

[Arlen Holder]

UPDATE:

As per Andy's suggestion, I'm running for a week at a time, almost 24/7
with a few boots in between due to normal operation of the PC, with very
small changes to the memory card situation.

The original memory cards were labeled as per the original slots:
o With four 4GB memory cards labeled 1 to 4 in memory slots 1 to 4.

The only consistent thing about these BSOD's since last December is that
merely shuffling the cards in the memory slots "appears" to make the
machine more reliable for the next boot after a BSOD.

Following up on that only consistent hint, I've been running (randomly
selected) memory card 3 in memory slot 2 as shown in this prior photo:
o <https://i.postimg.cc/GpGdHnxs/bsod213.jpg>

After a week of no BSODs, yesterday I added memory card 1 in slot 4.
o <Loading Image...>

In addition, I followed up on Andy's suggestion to secure the HDDs
o Where I need to find a source of the missing special bolts!
<Loading Image...>

In addition, I've noticed that the disk manager shows that crash logs are
enabled, which is a nice doublecheck that you're all set for the next BSoD.
o Have you noticed a "Crash Dump" description when you run disk management?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/FSfbmPq3wlM>
<Loading Image...>

[Arlen Holder]

UPDATE:
o Previous: Caused by address: ntoskrnl.exe+3f3ea0
o Current_: Caused by address: ntoskrnl.exe+3f45a0

IMAGES:
o <Loading Image...> KMODE EXCEPTION NOT HANDLED
o <Loading Image...> Who Crashed
o <Loading Image...> Blue Screen View
o <Loading Image...> App Crash View
o <Loading Image...> perfmon /rel shortcut
o <Loading Image...> eventvwr filter shortcut

After stress testing two 4GB RAM sticks for about a week...
o Optimistically, last night I had added the other two 4GB RAM sticks...

Within an hour of adding the last two RAMs, I got a STOP CODE
at 11/1/2020 / 18:47:50 Pacific, according to my EXIF information
o <https://i.postimg.cc/fRngbsGX/bsod220.jpg> KMODE EXCEPTION NOT HANDLED

Here's the approximate dates I added those 4GB memory sticks:
o 10/15/2020 4GB Memory 3 was put in motherboard RAM bank 2
o 10/22/2020 4GB Memory 1 was put in motherboard RAM bank 4
o 11/01/2020 4GB Memory 2 was put in motherboard RAM bank 1
o 11/01/2020 4GB Memory 4 was put in motherboard RAM bank 3
(It's currently running fully populated for stress testing.)

BSOD diagnosis was slowed down by WhoCrashed failing to work:
o Has your current copy of WhoCrashed home free version suddenly expired?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/DV15x2Wuv6k>
Due to (caveat emptor) a hidden secret hard-coded expiry date.

Nonetheless, an updated WhoCrashed eventually worked without failure:
o Taskbar > menu > hardware > bsod > WhoCrashed
o <https://i.postimg.cc/fLFHgx4D/bsod221.jpg>
"On Sun 11/1/2020 6:46:29 PM
crash dump file: C:\Windows\MEMORY.DMP
This was probably caused by the following module:
ntkrnlmp.exe (nt!HvlPerformEndOfInterrupt+0x4DEE)
Bugcheck code: 0x1E (0xFFFFFFFFC0000005, 0xFFFFF80325325B70, 0x0, 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF)
Error: KMODE_EXCEPTION_NOT_HANDLED

On Sun 11/1/2020 6:46:29 PM
crash dump file: C:\Windows\Minidump\110120-31890-01.dmp
This was probably caused by the following module:
ntoskrnl.exe (nt+0x3F45A0)
Bugcheck code: 0x1E (0xFFFFFFFFC0000005, 0xFFFFF80325325B70, 0x0, 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF)
Error: KMODE_EXCEPTION_NOT_HANDLED
file path: C:\Windows\system32\ntoskrnl.exe

o Taskbar > menu > hardware > bsod > BlueScreenView
BlueScreenView:
Dump File: 110120-31890-01.dmp
Crash Time: 11/1/2020 7:46:29 PM
Bug Check String: KMODE_EXCEPTION_NOT_HANDLED
Bug Check Code: 0x0000001e
Parameter 1: ffffffff'c0000005
Parameter 2: fffff803'25325b70
Parameter 3: 00000000'00000000
Parameter 4: ffffffff'ffffffff
Caused By Driver: ntoskrnl.exe
Caused By Address: ntoskrnl.exe+3f45a0
Processor: x64
Crash Adddress: ntoskrnl.exe+3f45a0
Full Path: C:\Windows\Minidump\110120-31890-01.dmp
Processors Count: 4
Major Version: 15
Minor Version: 19041
Dump File Size: 470,276
Dump File Date: 11/1/2020 7:56:11 PM

Interestingly, AppCrashView perhaps implicated MS Edge updates!
o Taskbar > menu > hardware > bsod > AppCrashView
o <https://i.postimg.cc/C5Jrw9XH/bsod223.jpg> App Crash View
TargetAppId=W:<long set of numbers>!setup.exe
TargetAppVer=2020//07//01:03:12:51!3f34d!MicrosoftEdgeUpdate.exe

The Event Viewer didn't tell me all that much that was useful:
o Taskbar > menu > hardware > bsod > Eventvwr Filter 41, 1074, 6006, 6008
o <https://i.postimg.cc/d1mbYx62/bsod225.jpg>

I ran the obligatory post-BSOD cleanup tasks:
o Win+R > cmd {control+shift+enter}
o stordiag.exe -collectEtw -checkfsconsistency -out %userprofile%\desktop
"Checking for corruption on drive: C
Running chkdsk on drive: C
o sfc /scannow
"Windows Resource Protection did not find any integrity violations."
o findstr /c:"[SR]" %windir%\Logs\CBS\CBS.log >"%userprofile%\Desktop\sfcdetails.txt"
o sfc /scannow
o sfc /scannow
o Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /CheckHealth
"No component store corruption detected."
o Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /ScanHealth
"No component store corruption detected."
o Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /RestoreHealth
"The restore operation completed successfully."
o sfc /scannow
"Windows Resource Protection did not find any integrity violations."
o chkdsk /f /r C: (or CHKDSK C: /F /R /X)
"This volume will be checked the next time the system restarts."
o shutdown.exe /r /f /t 5 /c "Reboot in 5 seconds"

o After logging back in, view the checkdisk logs:
Win+R > eventvwr
Event Viewer (Local) > Windows Logs > Application
Select "Filter Current Log"
In the Event sources dropdown, check
[x]Chkdsk
[x]Winit
[OK]
"Windows has scanned the file system and found no problems."